Bass Guitar Master

Techs and Players…

admin — Tue, 24 Oct 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

I’ve said here many times before- as a player, at its most basic, it’s always seemed to me that there are two roads to personal tone mecca (not including chops and shedding which comes first, -always)… 1.] Signal chain in front of long established muscle car amps. 2.] Ferrari / Maserati amps. Either way, …you pay. The upside to being a non-tech player- I think it’s easier to come back to a problem and undo a fuckup with stomp box choice and order…slapping patch cords around, insulating against electromagnetic hum, etc. -than to face some awful problem –after the solder has cooled. The thing is, 99% of us as early players weren’t born rich and spoiled by parents to begin with (like some today). Then again, the worse ones I’ve witnessed are older guys with mega-credit card capacity and almost zero sweat equity into learning the instrument, walking out of boutique shops with INCREDIBLE gear… Also, things like BadCat amps or Boogies and a shitload of cool boutique stomp boxes) weren’t invented yet. So most of us came up a long trail of gear tears –learning that came with acquiring deep cynicism at the music eq. gear sales biz along the way. I just spent a couple of hours tonight undoing a fuckup I created last week. (Merely removed a component, switched others around and w/ one, entered the software patches via MIDI, changing several variables inc. EQ around). Real simple shit to undo, but painful nonetheless. It’s good to tinker yet great to arrive back where you started sometimes -and that’s with my OWN shit. I honestly can’t imagine what it must be like to snafu someone else’s work tools -esp. if that’s how they make a living. It’s gotta be damn near sleepless at times. Here’s to the great ones among you who’ve been there and survived that, and here’s a laugh at the lesser among you lacking the balls to admit the worst of what -you once did too. mvm

Response:

> I’ve said here many times before- as a player, at its most basic, it’s > always seemed to me that there are two roads to personal tone mecca (not > including chops and shedding which comes first, -always)…

For me, it’s usually enough that the guitar is good and the signal goes into an 12AX7 or equivalent, and the rest of the chain is unimportant, as long as it’s quality stuff. No matter if I play into a Twin or a Boogie combo or a Marshall head or pre, or a tech-21 stompbox direct to PC, the only real difference for me is whether I mic a speaker or play direct. All else is a matter of gain levels and some EQ after the fact; usually I tend to use whatever preset the amp or whatever has, and it works pretty well as is. Always sounds more or less the same, the difference being mostly in clarity/boominess/etc. not the basic sound. I mean of course they sound different at first, but after a few settings or style changes, it always ends up sounding just the same on record, no matter what I’ve used to create the sound originally. But I prefer a tube up front and enough sustain and overdrive and singing qualities so I can hear my playing well and adjust picking accordingly. For bass, it’s even more simple – just a tube D/I box will do, then it’s off to a PA or disk. All else is best done after the fact, on board or whatever.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’ve said here many times before- as a player, at its most basic, it’s > always seemed to me that there are two roads to personal tone mecca (not > including chops and shedding which comes first, -always)… > For me, it’s usually enough that the guitar is good and the signal goes into > an 12AX7 or equivalent, and the rest of the chain is unimportant, as long as > it’s quality stuff. No matter if I play into a Twin or a Boogie combo or a > Marshall head or pre, or a tech-21 stompbox direct to PC, the only real > difference for me is whether I mic a speaker or play direct. All else is a > matter of gain levels and some EQ after the fact; usually I tend to use > whatever preset the amp or whatever has, and it works pretty well as is. > Always sounds more or less the same, the difference being mostly in > clarity/boominess/etc. not the basic sound. > I mean of course they sound different at first, but after a few settings or > style changes, it always ends up sounding just the same on record, no matter > what I’ve used to create the sound originally. But I prefer a tube up front > and enough sustain and overdrive and singing qualities so I can hear my > playing well and adjust picking accordingly. > For bass, it’s even more simple – just a tube D/I box will do, then it’s off > to a PA or disk. All else is best done after the fact, on board or > whatever.

Well put and appreciated, DeeAa. I think there’s tremendous fun to be had in playing through another guy’s entire rig too. I mean, it’s simple to walk into a Gc and sample amps. And true, many of them also have pre-assembled rigs to try out. Mine is in a carry case. You know those glass rooms all the GC’s have now? Great to try different amps w/ your own signal chain too. Also, every ___nth visit, you meet some secure, good guys and they can try your rig, and you can prod them for any improvement feedback. This particularly true for self-designed patches as well as adjustments. Also, different players have different ear-goals and sense of professional players tone -how to find it w/ what you’ve got. Clearly, there’s no better place to do this than a local sit-in night, but often, the competitive, insecure ego bit leaves guys doing anything but collaborating. They think it’s all about "cutting heads", as if that’s cool all the time.

Response:

What's the use of the Send/Return Loop

admin — Sat, 21 Oct 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Hello, Behind Fender amps there are 2 jack connectors for the effect Send/Return loop. When to use this loop exactly? For instance, I have a distortion pedal, should I plug it here or between my guitar and my amp? Thank you for your help

Response:

> Hello, > Behind Fender amps there are 2 jack connectors for the effect Send/Return > loop. When to use this loop exactly? For instance, I have a distortion > pedal, should I plug it here or between my guitar and my amp? > Thank you for your help

Both will work.

Response:

Though some nut case said both will work. You should use the loop for delay type effects. Flanger, digital delay, chorus, phaser stuff like that. Any distortion should really be before the preamp stage. Also every loop I have tried seemed to artificially boost the volume while the effect was on. I do not like that. — The Pentatonic Scale Explained http://bluechainlightning.net – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thank you for your help

Response:

>Hello, >Behind Fender amps there are 2 jack connectors for the effect Send/Return >loop. When to use this loop exactly? For instance, I have a distortion >pedal, should I plug it here or between my guitar and my amp? >Thank you for your help

Distortion pedals belong in front of the amp. Time based pedals, like delays seem to be better suited for effects loops.

Response:

>> Hello, > Behind Fender amps there are 2 jack connectors for the effect Send/Return > loop. When to use this loop exactly? For instance, I have a distortion > pedal, should I plug it here or between my guitar and my amp? > Though some nut case said both will work. You should use the loop > for delay type effects. Flanger, digital delay, chorus, phaser stuff like > that. Any distortion should really be before the preamp stage. Also > every loop I have tried seemed to artificially boost the volume while > the effect was on. I do not like that.

Some whack job has his likes and dislikes like everyone else (laughing). Who knows man? Niether of my amps (‘59 Tweed Bassman R.I., and a Musicman 2X10) has an efx. loop, but a Zoom GFX-8 in my signal chain does, and I put Fulltone’s Full Drive2 in it. Shrug. "The Pentatonic Scale Explained". No wonder *this* went _RIGHT_ over that poor guy’s pin head For Guitar Players: Modal Playing Made _Practical_ by Marc Mulay www.geocities.com/mvm55555 This merely addresses the practical playing applicability of each modal form of the diatonic major scale as illustrated. Scroll down now and look at each modal ‘box’. Note where to the right, I’ve noted the chord it best fits with on a stand-alone basis. As an aside, if you’re pretty good with the whole Andy Summers palette of sus2, sus4, add2 add4 then any of the modal ii, iii, or vi forms will sound great with them. We’re "beginning at the beginning" of the neck, first position, first note, 6th string, the note "F". In these diagrams, beginning with a blank space -sometimes two- is obviously where you would jump forward on a string a fret or two away from the nut, toward your bridge. _ILLUSTRATIVE_KEY_: * * * = "1,3,5" As in, root, skip a fret hit, skip a fret hit. * * * = "1,2,4" As in, fret, next fret hit, skip a fret hit. * * * = "1,3,4" As in, fret, skip a fret hit, next fret hit. _ALL_NUMBERS_ARE_FRET_NUMBERS_ Major / "Ionian" ; Start | | 1 3 5 6th "FAT" 1 3 5 2 3 5 <—NUT –BRIDGE Chord I: F, FMaj7, Maj9th 2 3 5 3 5 6 3 5 6 1st "THIN" Now Dorian- 3 5 6 3 5 7 3 5 7 Chord ii: Gm, Gm7, Gm9 3 5 7 5 6 8 5 6 8 Gitcha some phrygian now baby! 5 6 8 5 7 8 5 7 8 Chord iii: Am, Am7, Am9 5 7 9 6 8 10 6 8 10 Lydian: 6 8 10 7 8 10 7 8 10 Chord IV: BbMaj, BbMaj7, BbMaj9 7 9 10 8 10 11 8 10 12 Mixolydian: 8 10 12 8 10 12 8 10 12 You know this and the next 2 9 10 12 10 11 13 10 12 13 Aeolian: 10 12 13 10 12 13 10 12 14 10 12 14 11 13 15 12 13 15 Finally, the 7th mode of the Major scale, Locrian: 12 13 15 12 13 15 12 14 15 12 14 15 13 15 17 13 15 17 Note- your first finger is now back on the ‘F’ note of the 1st string at the 13th fret. This all begins again with the Ionian scale at the 13th fret, just as was the case at the first fret; 13 15 17 6th "FAT" 13 15 17 1415 17 <—NUT — BRIDGE 1415 17 15 17 18 15 17 18 1st "THIN" Notice that each modal form ends with a three note sequence on the 1st string which defines the exact same three notes of the 6th string beginning the next mode! This is central to seeing the bigger picture; how the modal forms all smoothly interlock to create a perfectly connected "treadmill" on the neck. Next, how to link them up, hop around, where they fit into chords, and how they’re over-layed by every one of the five M/m Pentas and Blues grids. As is the case with virtually every athletic sport, there’s *NO* way around proficiency with modal playing other than…repetition. Alternate picking: Starting with Ionian, walk the form at each position on the neck from the first to the 15th fret. AT EACH FRET, PLAY THE MODE IN REVERSE TOO. FORWARD, REVERSE. THEN MOVE ON TO THE NEXT FRET. Don’t start Dorian until you’ve "mastered" Ionian Same with Phrygian, Lydian, Mixolydian, Aeolian, and Locrian. WHEN YOU HAVE DONE THIS, PAUSE, THEN STARTING WITH ‘F IONIAN’ RUN IT INTO G DORIAN—A PHRYGIAN—Bb LYDIAN to E Locrian a couple of times. Get each "mastered" before moving on to the next. You are building a powerful foundation. THIS is training. Self-discipline. You’re getting all of this stuff under your fingers and deeply into muscle memory. Day after day, week after week, month after month. It’s the only way. Do it. Now Diatonic Theory is just taking a scale and building chords on top of each root note. Here’s where common sense/logic should lock into place for you regarding the diatonic layout of the major scale re; R 3 5 and 7. [btw- Chord extensions to 9ths, 11ths and 13th's apply too!] The ‘F’ major scale is what we’ll look at(because we’ve laid out the whole modal/scale system from Fret 1, 6th string, note ‘F’ as an ‘agreed-upon’ begin with the beginning point, purely for logical flow illustrative purposes). I ii iii IV V vi vii F Gm7 Am7 BbMaj7 C7 Dm7 Ebm7b5 The modes, Ionian-Locrian can just as easily be named 1-7. (I-vii). They line up perfectly with the sequential progression above and in every other key. Don’t ever ‘F-up’ by forgetting that there’s always a 1/2 step hop between iii and IV. Also, note- I, IV and V are always major, thus upper case for illustrative purposes. ii, iii, vi, and sorta vii are all minor, thus lower case. The minor modes, Dorian, Phrgian and Aeolian, -alway fit over minor chords. The major modes, Ionian, Lydian and Mixolydian -over the major chords. The Locrian was made for the half diminished or m7b5 chord. If you’re a rocker or bluzer, that ranks right up there with what’s a little toe for anyway? Shhhhhhhhwiiiingggggggg Where all of this work begins to turn to fun, and then payoff, is where you integrate the overlay of the modal system over pentatonic or blues boxes. Any/every player can find these, however for basic illustrative purposes, let’s say you’re playing ye old Blues Box #1 at the 5th fret: A. 5 8 .046 5 6 7 5 7 <— Box #1 5 7 5 8 5 8 .010 Now, play the Dorian form _there_, starting of course at A, 6th string, 5th fret. Voila. You’re locked in. Toward the bridge into phrygian or back toward the nut into Ionian, then Locrian…again, if you want to work this back toward the nut and forward, you’re in A Blues by playing your Locrian form starting at the 2nd Fret, F# 6th string and moving forward. As you internalize the whole modal system over time, you’ll get to the point you’ve probably been stuck at with pentatonic or blues boxes in that you’re probably comfortable jumping from "Blues Box 1" -say at the 5th fret(keyed off the 6th string), to say, "Blues Box 3" at the 10th fret. In this instance, the modal form equivalent would be to play that A Dorian form starting at A, 6th string, 5th fret, and leap up to the Mixolydian form at the 10th fret. It all starts to really "happen" for you as you think less and play more…timing, rhythm, dynamics like bends, hammer ons and pull offs in conjunction with the tone(s) YOUR ear digs make all this grunt work pay off with tons of extra colors and textures. The real key is grabbing phrases from each form and making them YOUR licks. Jam OWN it

Response:

Agreed across the board, including the observation about taste being the final arbiter. But no one mentioned WHY time-based effects are often preferred in the loop, and why distortion pedals are generally avoided there. I can describe why in terms of sound (it simply sounds better), but I’m not sure I understand the technical reasons. Maybe it’s because the loop does tend to add a tiny bit of pre-amp to the effect -which doesn’t help a distortion pedal, but does seem to really bring out the best a delay pedal has to offer. I can live quite easily without a loop, but when I am using an amp that has one, I tend to use it. Chuck (who has fired yet another drummer and is ready to declare jihad on percussionists in general) www.monkeychild.com

Response:

>Chuck (who has fired yet another drummer and is ready to declare jihad >on percussionists in general) >www.monkeychild.com

If your band had two drummers, you could fire twice as many. Pete (it has a good beat, and I can dance to it)

Response:

> >Chuck (who has fired yet another drummer and is ready to declare jihad >on percussionists in general) >www.monkeychild.com > If your band had two drummers, you could fire twice as many. > Pete (it has a good beat, and I can dance to it)

That would be like having two wives. One is more than sufficient. Chuck (auditioning one tomorrow) (drummer I mean)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hello, >Behind Fender amps there are 2 jack connectors for the effect Send/Return >loop. When to use this loop exactly? For instance, I have a distortion >pedal, should I plug it here or between my guitar and my amp? > Though some nut case said both will work. You should use the loop > for delay type effects. Flanger, digital delay, chorus, phaser stuff like > that. Any distortion should really be before the preamp stage. Also > every loop I have tried seemed to artificially boost the volume while > the effect was on. I do not like that.

I agree that you should generally go DISTORTION > TIME BASED EFFECTS > AMPLIFICATION. However, some distortion devices give you line level ins and outs, and might sound better in the loop. You can STILL follow such a distortion with your time based effects, then back to the return!

Response:

> Agreed across the board, including the observation about taste being > the final arbiter. But no one mentioned WHY time-based effects are > often preferred in the loop, and why distortion pedals are generally > avoided there. I can describe why in terms of sound (it simply sounds > better), but I’m not sure I understand the technical reasons.

The first technical reason you generally don’t want a distortion pedal in the loop is that the input level will be too hot and you’ll overdrive the pedal to the point it sounds like POO. But there are distortion units that give you line level inputs (like the rackmount Chandler Tube Driver). As far as not using chorus, flange, phase, reverb… before distortion goes, all you do is distort the effect an lose most of it in noise. Some guys like a short delay in front of distortion. It thickens the tone in a different way than placing it after the distortion. Maybe > it’s because the loop does tend to add a tiny bit of pre-amp to the > effect -which doesn’t help a distortion pedal,

Too hot of a level. but does seem to really > bring out the best a delay pedal has to offer.

If you play dead clean, it makes less of a difference. The problem is using time based before preamp distortion. Note that you could be following the loop with power tube crunch. But I don’t know of any effects that work at speaker level! …other than mike the amp, THEN put time based effects in the chain to the PA or second clean amp. When recording, I’d put time based stuff AFTER the speaker. I can live quite easily – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> without a loop, but when I am using an amp that has one, I tend to use > it. > Chuck (who has fired yet another drummer and is ready to declare jihad > on percussionists in general) > www.monkeychild.com

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> Hello, >> Behind Fender amps there are 2 jack connectors for the effect >> Send/Return >> loop. When to use this loop exactly? For instance, I have a distortion >> pedal, should I plug it here or between my guitar and my amp? > Though some nut case said both will work. You should use the loop > for delay type effects. Flanger, digital delay, chorus, phaser stuff like > that. Any distortion should really be before the preamp stage. Also > every loop I have tried seemed to artificially boost the volume while > the effect was on. I do not like that. > I agree that you should generally go DISTORTION > TIME BASED EFFECTS > > AMPLIFICATION. > However, some distortion devices give you line level ins and outs, and > might sound better in the loop. You can STILL follow such a distortion > with your time based effects, then back to the return!

Check out std. GFX-8 order of eeffects w/in a patch; http://www.fineclaymatrix.co.uk/gfx8/gfx8_effects.htm

Response:

Effects list Drive Module 1. Fdr Clean 2. Fdr Drive 3. Ms Crunch 4. Ms Drive 5. Bg Drive 6. Pvy Drive – Lovely distortion! 7. Vx Crunch 8. Power Lead 9. Vintage Over Drive 10. Over Drive 11. Vintage Distortion 12. Distortion 13. Fuzz 14. Wild Metal 15. Compressor 16. Comp+Crunch 17. Comp+Over Drive 18. Comp+Distortion 19. External Distortion 20. Acoustic – clean and quiet 21. User Custom 1 22. User Custom 2 Znr/Eq Module 23. Znr(Zoom Noise Reduction) 24. Equalizer 25. Amp Simulator Modulation Module 26. Chorus – make guitar sound thicker 27. Ce Chorus – warm 28. Vibrate 29. Flanger – a jet engine swooshing effect 30. Phase – swooping effect 31. Tremolo – up and down volume change 32. Pedal Wah 33. Auto Wah 34. Step – odd steping modulation effect 35. Cry – talking modulator 36. Pitch Shifter 37. Pedal Pitch 38. Ring Modulator – creates harmonics, often metallic sounding (usually crap) 39. Slow Attack – violin like, volume rise with each note picked 40. Delay – echo effect 41. Timetrip – varies delay depending on picking speed 42. Bpm Delay – delay with respect to Beats Per Minute 43. Hold Delay 44. Tremolo+Chorus 45. Ring Modulator+Vibrate 46. Custom1 47. Custom2 Delay/Reverb Module 48. Hall Reverb – adds spacious feel as though in a hall 49. Room Reverb 50. Delay+Hall 51. Delay+Room 52. Pinpong Delay – delay ping pongs left and right 53. Seamless Delay – delay continues for up to 3 seconds after patch change 54. Chorus+Delay 55. Echo 56. Stereo Chorus 57. Autopan – stereo focus shifts between left and right 58. Pitchshifter+Delay 59. Bend Chorus – pitch bending follows picked notes 60. Jam Play – see here Sfx Module 61. Sampler – see here 62. Autowah+Tremolo 63.Gate Reverb – reverb effect for which the envelope (attack, decay) can be specified 64. Harmonized Pitchshifter – harmonics added according a particular key 65. Twin Pitchshifter – two pitch shifters 66. Sample&Hold – samples a picked note and holds it 67. Synth Efect – Creates a synthesiser sound 68. Custom 1 69. Custom 2

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>> Hello, >>> Behind Fender amps there are 2 jack connectors for the effect >>> Send/Return loop. When to use this loop exactly? For instance, I have a >>> distortion pedal, should I plug it here or between my guitar and my amp? > I agree that you should generally go DISTORTION > TIME BASED EFFECTS > > AMPLIFICATION. > However, some distortion devices give you line level ins and outs, and > might sound better in the loop. You can STILL follow such a > distortion with your time based effects, then back to the return! > GFX-8 Effects list > Drive Module > 1. Fdr Clean > 2. Fdr Drive > 3. Ms Crunch > 4. Ms Drive > 5. Bg Drive > 6. Pvy Drive – Lovely distortion! > 7. Vx Crunch > 8. Power Lead > 9. Vintage Over Drive > 10. Over Drive > 11. Vintage Distortion > 12. Distortion > 13. Fuzz > 14. Wild Metal > 15. Compressor > 16. Comp+Crunch > 17. Comp+Over Drive > 18. Comp+Distortion > 19. External Distortion > 20. Acoustic – clean and quiet > 21. User Custom 1 > 22. User Custom 2 > Znr/Eq Module > 23. Znr(Zoom Noise Reduction) > 24. Equalizer > 25. Amp Simulator > Modulation Module > 26. Chorus – make guitar sound thicker > 27. Ce Chorus – warm > 28. Vibrate > 29. Flanger – a jet engine swooshing effect > 30. Phase – swooping effect > 31. Tremolo – up and down volume change > 32. Pedal Wah > 33. Auto Wah > 34. Step – odd steping modulation effect > 35. Cry – talking modulator > 36. Pitch Shifter > 37. Pedal Pitch > 38. Ring Modulator – creates harmonics, often metallic sounding (usually > crap) > 39. Slow Attack – violin like, volume rise with each note picked > 40. Delay – echo effect > 41. Timetrip – varies delay depending on picking speed > 42. Bpm Delay – delay with respect to Beats Per Minute > 43. Hold Delay > 44. Tremolo+Chorus > 45. Ring Modulator+Vibrate > 46. Custom1 > 47. Custom2 > Delay/Reverb Module > 48. Hall Reverb – adds spacious feel as though in a hall > 49. Room Reverb > 50. Delay+Hall > 51. Delay+Room > 52. Pinpong Delay – delay ping pongs left and right > 53. Seamless Delay – delay continues for up to 3 seconds after patch > change > 54. Chorus+Delay > 55. Echo > 56. Stereo Chorus > 57. Autopan – stereo focus shifts between left and right > 58. Pitchshifter+Delay > 59. Bend Chorus – pitch bending follows picked notes > 60. Jam Play – see here > Sfx Module > 61. Sampler – see here > 62. Autowah+Tremolo > 63.Gate Reverb – reverb effect for which the envelope (attack, decay) > can be specified > 64. Harmonized Pitchshifter – harmonics added according a particular key > 65. Twin Pitchshifter – two pitch shifters > 66. Sample&Hold – samples a picked note and holds it > 67. Synth Efect – Creates a synthesiser sound > 68. Custom 1 > 69. Custom 2

FYI- Key for Drive module above; FDR CLEAN: Fender Twin Clean channel FD DRIVE: Fender Twin Drive channel MS CRUNCH: Marshall JCM800 MS DRIVE: Marshall JCM900 BG DRIVE: Mesa/Boogie Rectifier PV DRIVE: Peavy 5150 VX CRUNCH: VOX AC30 POWER LEAD: original VINTAGE OD: BOSS OD-1 OVERDRIVE: original VINTAGE DIST: Marshall Guv’nor DISTORTION: original FUZZ: original WILD METAL: original COMPRESSOR: original

Response:

Would You Believe……..

admin — Sat, 10 Jun 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

From the Jams Improviser’s Laboratory. Would you believe there are three bass players playing on this tune. The four string bass guitar starts it out with the phantom voice. Then I join in along the way with the Ugly Stick, for lack of a better term to call it at the moment. There are two guitar players, along with the drums. You should have been there to hear all the low end going on in the room. http://timeelect.com/music/furgoat.mp3 Regards, Rich Koerner, Time Electronics. http://www.timeelect.com Specialists in Live Sound FOH Engineering, Music & Studio Production, Vintage Instruments, and Tube Amplifiers

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->From the Jams Improviser’s Laboratory. >Would you believe there are three bass players playing on this tune. >The four string bass guitar starts it out with the phantom voice. Then I join in along the way with >the Ugly Stick, for lack of a better term to call it at the moment. >There are two guitar players, along with the drums. >You should have been there to hear all the low end going on in the room. >http://timeelect.com/music/furgoat.mp3 >Regards, >Rich Koerner, >Time Electronics. >http://www.timeelect.com >Specialists in Live Sound FOH Engineering, > Music & Studio Production, >Vintage Instruments, and Tube Amplifiers

Not bad, but that one needed a Fender Rhodes to carry it.

Response:

Gibson GA15-RVT Explorer – more gain less treble – question

admin — Mon, 08 May 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Hi – long time reader first time poster… I have a mid 60’s GA15-RVT that I have recently been working on. I have converted it to a three prong, replaced the electrolytics, and put in a new (used pro jr) output transformer, and replaced the original speaker with a Eminence 102 alnico (35watt I believe). Also, after lots of reading on AGA and elsewhere on the net I did the mods outlined by John King and others here: http://groups.google.com/group/alt.guitar.amps/browse_thread/thread/f… The results are pretty good. The amp is very quiet hiss wise and sounds good enough that I have used it on several smaller gigs (generally dimed on the volume). Sorry for the long windedness, I’m getting there My dislikes about though are that it’s still is too bright – I usually run the bass on 8-10 and the treble on about 3. I would also like for it to go into OD just a little more. All out it just breaks up slightly. The gain increases if I up the treble – but like I said it is allready too trebly. I am using this with single coils BTW. Another thing I have noticed is that this is partly the speaker I believe. When played through my 2×12 with a Weber Blue and a G12H-30 the bass is a lot better. While I know a 10" is not going to get the same results I think it should get closer. So, after all that my questions are – is there a way to get it to break up a bit sooner, like additional tweaks to the circuit? How about adding a sag resistor? Would changing the value of the volume pot allow me to tame the brightness, yet drive the preamp more by turning it to a higher value? And finally any suggestions on a speaker? I was thinking maybe a Weber 10F150-O. (Warm, big bottom, early breakup, very crunchy, loud – is it’s description). Thanks – I have already learned a TON from the knowledge shared here on AGA.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hi – long time reader first time poster… > I have a mid 60’s GA15-RVT that I have recently been working on. I have > converted it to a three prong, replaced the electrolytics, and put in a > new (used pro jr) output transformer, and replaced the original speaker > with a Eminence 102 alnico (35watt I believe). > Also, after lots of reading on AGA and elsewhere on the net I did the > mods outlined by John King and others here: > http://groups.google.com/group/alt.guitar.amps/browse_thread/thread/f… > The results are pretty good. The amp is very quiet hiss wise and sounds > good enough that I have used it on several smaller gigs (generally > dimed on the volume). > Sorry for the long windedness, I’m getting there > My dislikes about though are that it’s still is too bright – I usually > run the bass on 8-10 and the treble on about 3. I would also like for > it to go into OD just a little more. All out it just breaks up > slightly. The gain increases if I up the treble – but like I said it is > allready too trebly. > I am using this with single coils BTW. Another thing I have noticed is > that this is partly the speaker I believe. When played through my 2×12 > with a Weber Blue and a G12H-30 the bass is a lot better. While I know > a 10" is not going to get the same results I think it should get > closer. > So, after all that my questions are – is there a way to get it to break > up a bit sooner, like additional tweaks to the circuit? How about > adding a sag resistor? Would changing the value of the volume pot allow > me to tame the brightness, yet drive the preamp more by turning it to a > higher value? And finally any suggestions on a speaker? I was thinking > maybe a Weber 10F150-O. (Warm, big bottom, early breakup, very crunchy, > loud – is it’s description). > Thanks – I have already learned a TON from the knowledge shared here on > AGA.

I may be able to help you on a couple of points: My main guitar for dialing in the tone on my Explorer is my favorite Gibson 335 copy. Of course I have played other, single coil, guitars through it, and I find it a bit "edgy" with them, just as you do. I think all you need to do is play around with the values in the tone stack to dial in the frequency peaks where you want them, instead of where they worked on my 335 copy. That might take care of the tone, but I’m not sure where/how to get more drive from the circuit. If you’re going to try another speaker, I’d suggest that being the first change you make, and work from there (or go back to the Eminence if you discover you liked it better). A "sag resistor" shouldn’t really make the amp "break up" (saturate) earlier, but will instead change the character of the dynamics some. Perhaps it might give a bit of "tweed" feel to the dynamics of the amp; which lacks such feel due to its use of diodes for rectification instead of a tube. Probably the easiest way of getting more drive from the amp would be to put a clean boost pedal in front of it. Effectively adding a gain stage to OD the preamp section (albeit solid state in most cases). From the looks of your header, you’re somewhere near me? Contact me directly if you want. My email isn’t munged. Regards, John King

Response:

I wonder, what is the value of the bypass cap on V1a and or has it drifted? I’ve got the Explorer’s big brother, the Minuteman GA20-RVT, a 2 channel amp with the second channel nearly identical to the Explorer. I noticed that the bypass cap was on the schematic but missing from the amp. Putting one in really improved the bass response. If you’ve got one in there, you might consider tweaking the value. IIRC, the schematic calls for 20mf, but you might try something a bit higher (33?) or lower (10?) just to see. Also, when I did the cap job, I used a JJ 2-section can cap rated at 32mf + 32mf in place of the 20+20. With a SS rectifier, I figured nothing bad would happen, and it did have an favorable impact on bass, making it more punchy. I admit that I don’t understand why, so please don’t ask me. I also think my amp is a little on the brittle side. I’ve been meaning to put it on the bench for quite some time now for the JK mods, but never seem to get around to it. It also needs some maintenance for a popcorn noise. At first I wasn’t sure what to believe about speaker advice, but I want to suggest that you experiment some. Speakers generally make a bigger difference than the output tranny on a small amp like this. Welcome to the world of Gibson amps. Regards, Phil

Response:

Hello mojowrkn I have a GA35-RVT. After installing a Weber C10N and increasing the cathode bias capacitors I got it to sound just like a Fender Deluxe Reverb. BORING. I put it back to stock, except for the Weber spearker. Yes, it is still a bit bright unless I roll the treble way down, but it sounds quite unique this way, kind of like an exaggerated blackface fender amp — very scooped mids. There are at least two sounds out of this amp that I really like, bright and brighter, and none of my other amps can duplicate these exactly. I have thought about putting a power amp section "tone cut" potentiometer and treble bleed capacitor in through the external speaker jack, a la Vox AC30, but so far have decided it isn’t worth the effort. Have fun experimenting.

Response:

What tubes do you have in there?

Response:

> What tubes do you have in there?

My GA35-RVT uses a couple of 6EU7, a 12AU7, OA2 (gas tube regulator), two 7591 power tubes. I think the unusual tone stacks and anemic cathode bias capacitors are responsibile for the brittle tone of some of the white panel amps. In my case the stock CTS speaker was inefficient as hell, the cone was stiff, and the sound was way too bright as well — probably had gone to hell with age. Chris Taylor Boston

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->What tubes do you have in there? > My GA35-RVT uses a couple of 6EU7, a 12AU7, OA2 (gas tube regulator), > two 7591 power tubes. I think the unusual tone stacks and anemic > cathode bias capacitors are responsibile for the brittle tone of some > of the white panel amps. In my case the stock CTS speaker was > inefficient as hell, the cone was stiff, and the sound was way too > bright as well — probably had gone to hell with age. > Chris Taylor > Boston

The GA-5, 15RVT and 20RVT out of the "white panel" series are really very different animals from the 35,45, and 55RVT with the circuit you describe. I’ve had a couple of the 45 and 55, but not the 35 like you have. I’m not a real fan of that circuit. The whole "Williamson" phase/power section and the OA2 voltage regulator is just a bad design for the tube amp tone most folks are interested in (IMO). The smaller amps from that series are much more simple in design, and I like them because they’re easy to tinker with. The only way I’d buy any more of the larger white panel series, is if I got them dirt cheap in hopes of turning a profit on them. In fact, I’ve still got one GA-45RVT Saturn (2x 6L6 and 2-10") I’ve tinkered with it endlessly to get it sounding right; all to no good end. I’ve threatened before to strip the board and use the chassis, cab, iron and maybe the board to make a totally different amp from it. I still hope to get around to doing that with it; because it seems hopeless as-is. John

Response:

Hello John. I wouldn’t mind at all having a lower power white panel like the 15RVT or 20RVT after all the good things I have heard about these on AGA. The GA35-RVT is pretty much a one-trick pony that doesn’t have the flexibility and nice break-up that people want these days in small amps, but I do like the sound. And yes, I sank way too much time and money into mine relative to the sonic results, but I had fun restoring it and will use it at least occasionally for recording. Doesn’t the 45 have a weird mid control circuit? Maybe that is part of the problem.. Chris Taylor Boston MA

Response:

Hi guys – thanks for the quick responses. To answer a few questions, the tubes are all used older American stuff, I can’t remember which is which. I have also tried a set of JJ EL-84’s that where matched. The filter caps are the original value of 20 mf (a multi cap can from Vibroworld). On the V1a bypass cap, if I have identified it correctly, this is the 2 MFD 25V described in John’s Mod #3. I originally replaced it with a Sprague electrolytic of the same value, and then per John’s mods I added another 25uF, 25V Sprague in parallel. Would it be safe to go further by upping that value a little more? It did increase the bass I think. Please correct me if I am talking about the wrong cap.

Response:

> Hi guys – thanks for the quick responses. > To answer a few questions, the tubes are all used older American stuff, > I can’t remember which is which. I have also tried a set of JJ EL-84’s > that where matched. The filter caps are the original value of 20 mf (a > multi cap can from Vibroworld). > On the V1a bypass cap, if I have identified it correctly, this is the 2 > MFD 25V described in John’s Mod #3. I originally replaced it with a > Sprague electrolytic of the same value, and then per John’s mods I > added another 25uF, 25V Sprague in parallel. Would it be safe to go > further by upping that value a little more? It did increase the bass I > think. Please correct me if I am talking about the wrong cap.

That’s the one. I think 25 is about as high as I would go. Maybe you can look at the tonestack to take some of the edge off.

Response:

Any suggestions? I notice that the treble pot is a 2 meg, anything there that could be changed? Caps? Thanks again guys. Here is the schematic: http://www.freeinfosociety.com/electronics/schematics/audio/gibsonga1…

Response:

> Any suggestions? I notice that the treble pot is a 2 meg, anything > there that could be changed? Caps? Thanks again guys. > Here is the schematic: > http://www.freeinfosociety.com/electronics/schematics/audio/gibsonga1…

There are 3 or 4 caps between V1a and the volume pot that you might fiddle with. Have you tried using Duncan’s tone stack calculator? http://www.duncanamps.com/tsc/

Response:

New peculiar rig :-)

admin — Tue, 11 Apr 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

I had this 100W PA monitor amp that has gain, volume and also bass and treble settings plus jacks for line out and extra speaker and even two inputs…and it was very small, built to fit inside an angled floor monitor. So I decided to mod a Marshall 4×10 cab by building this amp INTO the speaker cab. I did this by adding a 100W Eminence speaker for the PA amp, while the cab also has three original 10" Marshalls in it. Actually four, but the extra one is hidden inside the cab. Now I can put my Cream machine on top of it, and the CM drives the 10" speakers with all its mighty 5 W power, while I run a line from its Red Box line out to the poweramp, and get 100W more headroom and punch from the same enclosure! While I was at it, I also added some padding in the cab to cut the shrillness of the 4×10" a little, and also put some sound dissipators in front of the speaker cones to lessen projectivity. So now the tiny tube amp gives me the highs 100% tube at up to 100dB, and the SS power section and the 12" Eminence pumps out the lows the tiny amp can’t. This way I can run the setup at very little volume and still sound like a cranked Plexi, but I also have enough punch to play with drums etc. too if needed, and have the bag end and headroom too. And all I need to lug around is the 4×10" or now a 3×10"/1×12" 195W cab which is not huge at all, and the guitar in whose bag pocket the CM easily slips. Very little gear to lug! Also, if I want to, I can use my JMP-1 or a Tech-21 or any preamp and run that into the SS power section instead of the CM, AND I can still use the 10" speakers too by in that case sending them a signal from the extra speaker jack of the PA amp. OR, when they become available here, I’m perhaps going to start using a Epiphone Valve Junior head to drive the 10" speakers, I think. And because the PA amp has all the EQ and gain etc. controls needed, it’s really easy to adjust its sound too, since the CM only has volume and gain. It’s a funny amp – made by Solton – doesn’t seem to clip no matter how you drive it, I mean, it doesn’t clip ugly like an SS amp at all…built to take the feedback and abuse like a floor monitor. Now all I need is add some wheels to the cab…I’ll try to get some photos on the net later! I’ll even try to get some sounds maybe or video. Cheers, Dee

Response:

It seems like you’ll be whipping a dead horse as long as you’re using the tube preamp with a SS power amp. You’ve got it ass backwards Bro. You know what DeeAa? You’re at the level as a guitar player and musician that you’d sound good playing through anything. You’d sound better with a tube power amp and SS preamp though.

Response:

> It seems like you’ll be whipping a dead horse as long as you’re using > the tube preamp with a SS power amp. You’ve got it ass backwards > Bro.

Well, SOMEBODY has it "ass backwards," but it ain’t DeeAa. > You know what DeeAa? You’re at the level as a guitar player > and musician that you’d sound good playing through anything. You’d > sound better with a tube power amp and SS preamp though.

The Cream Machine HAS a tube power amp. Single ended 12AU7, with a small output transformer. When you use it as a preamp, you’re still using the power amp section of the Cream Machine. …not unlike early EVH, but on a smaller scale. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I had this 100W PA monitor amp that has gain, volume and also bass and > treble settings plus jacks for line out and extra speaker and even two > inputs…and it was very small, built to fit inside an angled floor > monitor. > So I decided to mod a Marshall 4×10 cab by building this amp INTO the > speaker cab. > I did this by adding a 100W Eminence speaker for the PA amp, while the > cab > also has three original 10" Marshalls in it. Actually four, but the > extra > one is hidden inside the cab. > Now I can put my Cream machine on top of it, and the CM drives the 10" > speakers with all its mighty 5 W power, while I run a line from its Red > Box > line out to the poweramp, and get 100W more headroom and punch from the > same > enclosure! While I was at it, I also added some padding in the cab to > cut > the shrillness of the 4×10" a little, and also put some sound > dissipators in > front of the speaker cones to lessen projectivity. > So now the tiny tube amp gives me the highs 100% tube at up to 100dB, > and > the SS power section and the 12" Eminence pumps out the lows the tiny > amp > can’t. > This way I can run the setup at very little volume and still sound like > a > cranked Plexi, but I also have enough punch to play with drums etc. too > if > needed, and have the bag end and headroom too. And all I need to lug > around > is the 4×10" or now a 3×10"/1×12" 195W cab which is not huge at all, > and the > guitar in whose bag pocket the CM easily slips. Very little gear to > lug! > Also, if I want to, I can use my JMP-1 or a Tech-21 or any preamp and > run > that into the SS power section instead of the CM, AND I can still use > the > 10" speakers too by in that case sending them a signal from the extra > speaker jack of the PA amp. OR, when they become available here, I’m > perhaps > going to start using a Epiphone Valve Junior head to drive the 10" > speakers, > I think. > And because the PA amp has all the EQ and gain etc. controls needed, > it’s > really easy to adjust its sound too, since the CM only has volume and > gain. > It’s a funny amp – made by Solton – doesn’t seem to clip no matter how > you > drive it, I mean, it doesn’t clip ugly like an SS amp at all…built to > take > the feedback and abuse like a floor monitor. > Now all I need is add some wheels to the cab…I’ll try to get some > photos > on the net later! I’ll even try to get some sounds maybe or video. > Cheers, > Dee

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I had this 100W PA monitor amp that has gain, volume and also bass and > treble settings plus jacks for line out and extra speaker and even two > inputs…and it was very small, built to fit inside an angled floor > monitor. > So I decided to mod a Marshall 4×10 cab by building this amp INTO the > speaker cab. > I did this by adding a 100W Eminence speaker for the PA amp, while the > cab > also has three original 10" Marshalls in it. Actually four, but the > extra > one is hidden inside the cab. > Now I can put my Cream machine on top of it, and the CM drives the 10" > speakers with all its mighty 5 W power, while I run a line from its Red > Box > line out to the poweramp, and get 100W more headroom and punch from the > same > enclosure! While I was at it, I also added some padding in the cab to > cut > the shrillness of the 4×10" a little, and also put some sound > dissipators in > front of the speaker cones to lessen projectivity. > So now the tiny tube amp gives me the highs 100% tube at up to 100dB, > and > the SS power section and the 12" Eminence pumps out the lows the tiny > amp > can’t. > This way I can run the setup at very little volume and still sound like > a > cranked Plexi, but I also have enough punch to play with drums etc. too > if > needed, and have the bag end and headroom too. And all I need to lug > around > is the 4×10" or now a 3×10"/1×12" 195W cab which is not huge at all, > and the > guitar in whose bag pocket the CM easily slips. Very little gear to > lug! > Also, if I want to, I can use my JMP-1 or a Tech-21 or any preamp and > run > that into the SS power section instead of the CM, AND I can still use > the > 10" speakers too by in that case sending them a signal from the extra > speaker jack of the PA amp. OR, when they become available here, I’m > perhaps > going to start using a Epiphone Valve Junior head to drive the 10" > speakers, > I think. > And because the PA amp has all the EQ and gain etc. controls needed, > it’s > really easy to adjust its sound too, since the CM only has volume and > gain. > It’s a funny amp – made by Solton – doesn’t seem to clip no matter how > you > drive it, I mean, it doesn’t clip ugly like an SS amp at all…built to > take > the feedback and abuse like a floor monitor. > Now all I need is add some wheels to the cab…I’ll try to get some > photos > on the net later! I’ll even try to get some sounds maybe or video. > Cheers, > Dee

> It seems like you’ll be whipping a dead horse as long as you’re using > the tube preamp with a SS power amp. You’ve got it ass backwards > Bro. You know what DeeAa? You’re at the level as a guitar player > and musician that you’d sound good playing through anything. You’d > sound better with a tube power amp and SS preamp though. > Keith, You misunderstand the setup. The ‘Cream Machine’ *IS* a complete tube amp that uses a 12A** Tube for the power section. It can put out a couple of watts into a cabinet all on it’s own and sound ok. Also, I think the CM’s line out is off of the power tube, so… However, in general principal, I agree with what you were thinking. In "Hybrid" amps, the tubes should be in the big end like Peavey and not the front end like Marshall and later hybrid attempts. Like you said: They got it bass-ackwards IMO. I *know* what he’s doing works good, because I discovered several variations of it myself many many years ago (1970s): The first was a cheesy high imp. Rat Shack mike placed inside the back of my ‘53 tweed deluxe, and plug it into the front of a 45 watt SS Peavy Pacer. Viola!!! A sweet sounding tweed Deluxe that was more than twice as loud, and now I had reverb too!!! Then I discovered how to build a rheostat attenuated voltage divider ‘line out’ circuit into the back of the tweed Deluxe in parallel with its speaker. That eliminated the mike, and increased the volume greatly. With the Deluxe stacked on top of the bigger Peavey, it was really a pretty hot little setup. Still had a hard time hearing it over my buds 50watt Marshall, and kept blowing the 12" Eminence / CTS? out of the Peavey. Ended up hogging out the baffle in the Pacer and sticking in a 100watt Rat Shack 15" guitar / bass / PA speaker. That one never burnt, and gave me a good bottom end to boot. John

Response:

> The first was a cheesy high imp. Rat Shack mike placed inside the back > of my ‘53 tweed deluxe, and plug it into the front of a 45 watt SS Peavy > Pacer. Viola!!! A sweet sounding tweed Deluxe that was more than twice > as loud, and now I had reverb too!!!

Yea, that’s the whole point – being able to use a tiny tube amp at low volumes, like the CM or maybe the Junior soon – and still generate enough additional boom via a slave amp to play with a band, if needed, but without the impossible task of overdriving a full-size tube poweramp. Sure I might like to use a 60W or so tube head thru a 4×12" but it only sounds good at volumes that they can hear in the next town even, completely unuseable. I like to be able to crank the amo to the absolute max and then even add some more imput gain to get to the real crunch…so it’s gotta be a 2-10W range amp. But those suckers, then again, have no headroom and can’t move any air. This setup gives the exact same sound but with complete control. The effect is strange; if I play just the CM and then start upping the volume on the SS part, it’s like somebody adjusts the bass and punch of the sound, like a subwoofer if you will. But you can’t tell it’s a different amp since they’re both built into the same closed enclosure and while the cones pump air, they react with each other and the result so far seems to work very well indeed. Can’t wait for the blues Jr’s to become available here, because while the CM is a nice li’l amp, it’s just lots of gain or even more…no semi-clean sounds whatsoever.

Response:

DeeAa… I’m curious, what (if anything) are you using for EQ in this setup? I’m interested in the Cream Machine, as what you’re doing now is very close to what I’ve wanted to do for years. In my case, I have a 100W solid state power amp that was the power section from an old Fender Rhodes keyboard. I’ll save the details of me and a high school buddy destroying the original cab, but regardless, I still have the amp. I also got a HUGE 2×12 cab years ago. It’s like the size of a Fender Showman cab, and I cut a square hole in one end to mount that power amp in the same way it was mounted in the Rhodes cab. So there…I have a powered, bigass 2×12 cab doing nothing. :-D Maybe I can start using it for something… I noticed you said the CM has a lot of gain. How clean can you get it? Do you think substituting the "preamp" 12AX7 for a 12AU7 or 12AT7 tame it a bit? ~jp – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Yea, that’s the whole point – being able to use a tiny tube amp at low > volumes, like the CM or maybe the Junior soon – and still generate enough > additional boom via a slave amp to play with a band, if needed, but without > the impossible task of overdriving a full-size tube poweramp. > Sure I might like to use a 60W or so tube head thru a 4×12" but it only > sounds good at volumes that they can hear in the next town even, completely > unuseable. I like to be able to crank the amo to the absolute max and then > even add some more imput gain to get to the real crunch…so it’s gotta be a > 2-10W range amp. > But those suckers, then again, have no headroom and can’t move any air. > This setup gives the exact same sound but with complete control. The effect > is strange; if I play just the CM and then start upping the volume on the SS > part, it’s like somebody adjusts the bass and punch of the sound, like a > subwoofer if you will. But you can’t tell it’s a different amp since they’re > both built into the same closed enclosure and while the cones pump air, they > react with each other and the result so far seems to work very well indeed. > Can’t wait for the blues Jr’s to become available here, because while the CM > is a nice li’l amp, it’s just lots of gain or even more…no semi-clean > sounds whatsoever.

Response:

DeeAa . . . . . . My, my, my . . . you’ve been very, very busy! Hope that you’re enjoying your new toy! The Cream Machine’s a real trip, huh? Play loud . . . it drowns out the bickering, Lulu ; )

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I had this 100W PA monitor amp that has gain, volume and also bass and >treble settings plus jacks for line out and extra speaker and even two >inputs…and it was very small, built to fit inside an angled floor >monitor. > So I decided to mod a Marshall 4×10 cab by building this amp INTO the > speaker cab. > I did this by adding a 100W Eminence speaker for the PA amp, while the cab > also has three original 10" Marshalls in it. Actually four, but the extra > one is hidden inside the cab. > Now I can put my Cream machine on top of it, and the CM drives the 10" > speakers with all its mighty 5 W power, while I run a line from its Red > Box line out to the poweramp, and get 100W more headroom and punch from > the same enclosure! While I was at it, I also added some padding in the > cab to cut the shrillness of the 4×10" a little, and also put some sound > dissipators in front of the speaker cones to lessen projectivity. > So now the tiny tube amp gives me the highs 100% tube at up to 100dB, and > the SS power section and the 12" Eminence pumps out the lows the tiny amp > can’t. > This way I can run the setup at very little volume and still sound like a > cranked Plexi, but I also have enough punch to play with drums etc. too if > needed, and have the bag end and headroom too. And all I need to lug > around is the 4×10" or now a 3×10"/1×12" 195W cab which is not huge at > all, and the guitar in whose bag pocket the CM easily slips. Very little > gear to lug! > Also, if I want to, I can use my JMP-1 or a Tech-21 or any preamp and run > that into the SS power section instead of the CM, AND I can still use the > 10" speakers too by in that case sending them a signal from the extra > speaker jack of the PA amp. OR, when they become available here, I’m > perhaps going to start using a Epiphone Valve Junior head to drive the 10" > speakers, I think. > And because the PA amp has all the EQ and gain etc. controls needed, it’s > really easy to adjust its sound too, since the CM only has volume and > gain. It’s a funny amp – made by Solton – doesn’t seem to clip no matter > how you drive it, I mean, it doesn’t clip ugly like an SS amp at > all…built to take the feedback and abuse like a floor monitor. > Now all I need is add some wheels to the cab…I’ll try to get some photos > on the net later! I’ll even try to get some sounds maybe or video. > Cheers, > Dee

Response:

>How clean can you get it? Do you think substituting the "preamp" 12AX7 for a 12AU7 >or 12AT7 tame it a bit?

It may, but I doubt it. There’s a *lot* of solid state circuitry under the hood of a CM….the first thing in the signal chain is a 5532 op amp stage. Followed by many more. For the most part, its a distortion box with the gimmick of a SE triode output stage. It wouldn’t be too hard to build something purely tube with a tube output stage (maybe a SE 6AQ5 or 6BM8, 6K6) that is more versatile.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->The first was a cheesy high imp. Rat Shack mike placed inside the back >of my ‘53 tweed deluxe, and plug it into the front of a 45 watt SS Peavy >Pacer. Viola!!! A sweet sounding tweed Deluxe that was more than twice >as loud, and now I had reverb too!!! > Yea, that’s the whole point – being able to use a tiny tube amp at low > volumes, like the CM or maybe the Junior soon – and still generate enough > additional boom via a slave amp to play with a band, if needed, but without > the impossible task of overdriving a full-size tube poweramp. > Sure I might like to use a 60W or so tube head thru a 4×12" but it only > sounds good at volumes that they can hear in the next town even, completely > unuseable.

Not all tube amps are unusable at lower volumes. Try a Marshall JMP 2204 with Mullard V1. I feed mine into a Hiwatt/Fane with mid 70’s lower sensitivity and darker voiced speakers. …and I hide the Hiwatt behind the back of the couch, to further reduce the SPL. Even with just preamp distortion, it sounds great. With power tube distortion, it just gets better. Over the weekend, I was enjoying my Cream Machine into my Vintage 30 cab. The Cream Machine is only about 1 true watt, but Vintage 30’s are so efficient that it is still about as loud as I usually play the 2204! I like to be able to crank the amo to the absolute max and then – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> even add some more imput gain to get to the real crunch…so it’s gotta be a > 2-10W range amp. > But those suckers, then again, have no headroom and can’t move any air. > This setup gives the exact same sound but with complete control. The effect > is strange; if I play just the CM and then start upping the volume on the SS > part, it’s like somebody adjusts the bass and punch of the sound, like a > subwoofer if you will. But you can’t tell it’s a different amp since they’re > both built into the same closed enclosure and while the cones pump air, they > react with each other and the result so far seems to work very well indeed. > Can’t wait for the blues Jr’s to become available here, because while the CM > is a nice li’l amp, it’s just lots of gain or even more…no semi-clean > sounds whatsoever.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > DeeAa… I’m curious, what (if anything) are you using for EQ in this > setup? I’m interested in the Cream Machine, as what you’re doing now > is very close to what I’ve wanted to do for years. > In my case, I have a 100W solid state power amp that was the power > section from an old Fender Rhodes keyboard. I’ll save the details of > me and a high school buddy destroying the original cab, but regardless, > I still have the amp. I also got a HUGE 2×12 cab years ago. It’s like > the size of a Fender Showman cab, and I cut a square hole in one end to > mount that power amp in the same way it was mounted in the Rhodes cab. > So there…I have a powered, bigass 2×12 cab doing nothing. :-D Maybe > I can start using it for something… I noticed you said the CM has a > lot of gain. How clean can you get it? Do you think substituting the > "preamp" 12AX7 for a 12AU7 or 12AT7 tame it a bit? > ~jp

The Cream Machine was built specifically to sound like a cranked Marshall. You will never get a pure clean tone out of it. For months, I’ve been running a 12AU7 in the preamp, but that really gives you more of a blues distortion, still NOT really clean. Last week, I put a Mullard 12ax7 back into the preamp hole, and it just sounds better. If you want a low power CLEAN tube amp, the Cream Machine is NOT for you. If you want a cranked Marshall tone, it is a great little unit. It sounds really good into Vintage 30 speakers, also. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Yea, that’s the whole point – being able to use a tiny tube amp at low >volumes, like the CM or maybe the Junior soon – and still generate enough >additional boom via a slave amp to play with a band, if needed, but without >the impossible task of overdriving a full-size tube poweramp. >Sure I might like to use a 60W or so tube head thru a 4×12" but it only >sounds good at volumes that they can hear in the next town even, completely >unuseable. I like to be able to crank the amo to the absolute max and then >even add some more imput gain to get to the real crunch…so it’s gotta be a >2-10W range amp. >But those suckers, then again, have no headroom and can’t move any air. >This setup gives the exact same sound but with complete control. The effect >is strange; if I play just the CM and then start upping the volume on the SS >part, it’s like somebody adjusts the bass and punch of the sound, like a >subwoofer if you will. But you can’t tell it’s a different amp since they’re >both built into the same closed enclosure and while the cones pump air, they >react with each other and the result so far seems to work very well indeed. >Can’t wait for the blues Jr’s to become available here, because while the CM >is a nice li’l amp, it’s just lots of gain or even more…no semi-clean >sounds whatsoever.

Response:

> The Cream Machine was built specifically to sound like a cranked > Marshall. You will never get a pure clean tone out of it. For months, > I’ve been running a 12AU7 in the preamp, but that really gives you more > of a blues distortion, still NOT really clean. Last week, I put a > Mullard 12ax7 back into the preamp hole, and it just sounds better. > If you want a low power CLEAN tube amp, the Cream Machine is NOT for > you. If you want a cranked Marshall tone, it is a great little unit. > It sounds really good into Vintage 30 speakers, also.

Hmm… Well, I guess I should’ve asked more questions the first time around. Does it clean up fairly well when you roll your guitar’s volume back? I’m not looking for something with seperate, defined clean and cranked sounds. I’m looking to emulate the non-master volume vibe, and have the ability to pull back the volume for "almost" clean. Not "Twin Reverb on 3" clean. Right now, while sitting around at home in the apartment, I play through a Vibro Champ with a Tone Bone Hot British in front of it–the Tone Bone is connected with a 2ft cord, sits on top of the amp, and doesn’t get switched off. I want a basic sound that’ll let me clean it up when I pull the volume back, and when I open up the volume on the guitar, will get close to say, Angus Young’s sound on Back in Black. Preferably something that would be set, and left on 100% of the time. If I need any distortion beyond that, I could supplement it with a pedal. Of course, the whole purpose of this is to have a light weight and portable rig with controllable volume. Otherwise I’d just buy a Plexi half stack ~jp

Response:

I dont know Jim. He stated somewhere plain as day that he was using an SS power section. After looking at the Cream Machines specs I see it uses a preamp tube as a power tube? Get outta town man. If they would have used an EL34 their product might have been worth looking into. Either way DeeAa . Like I said your playing would sound good through anything you want to amplify it with. Theres plenty of options besides 50 watt amps but you know what you want and what you’re doing. I’m not going to try and convince a guy with your experience into doing anything..

> It seems like you’ll be whipping a dead horse as long as you’re using > the tube preamp with a SS power amp. You’ve got it ass backwards > Bro.

Response:

You guys but all this high tech.expensive equipment and hook it all together to try and get the sound thats sitting right in front of your eyes in one enclosure. You can laugh and scoff and shell out all the money you want . I spent $130 on a 1966 Harmony H410 that’ll overdrive like butter or clean up slicker than a whistle. I changed the coupling caps to .1 mfd,disconnnected the tremolo,added a 10" alnico speaker (in the same cabinet ) to go along with the Jensen 8" alnico that was in it. It had 3 input jacks so I got rid of one and stuck a pot in its place to control the amount of power going into the other jack that I wired to serve as a line out. To hell with micing anything. It uses a single EL84 for the power section,a 12AU7 ( orX or T or Z or V ) for the preamp and a 5Y3 for rectification. If you want to use pedals with it then of course you can but I dont use anything but a delay/echo to give the sound some depth. Why foul up tube beauty with a bunch of SS state junk?. The whole sheebang tips the scales at a whopping 12 pounds. It doesnt look like much and people may sneer at it when you come trucking into a jam. They usually change their mind once its fired up. Simplicities where its at. Old simplicity to be precise.

Response:

I can’t guarantee that you’d be happy with the Cream Machine for lower gain, but it will do it. It will do something like a cleanish Super Lead tone, but it has much more output, with the distorted tone. It really shines with gain. In fact, I think that they designed it with a bit TOO MUCH gain (of course half of my guitars are active, and all but one passive have high output pickups). Depending on your guitar, it may or may not sound good dialing back your volume settings. Passive guitars tend to get darker as you dial down the volume (unless you have a treble bleed cap installed). If you have an EQ pedal, you might be happier. > Right now, while sitting around at home in the apartment, I play > through a Vibro Champ with a Tone Bone Hot British in front of it–the > Tone Bone is connected with a 2ft cord, sits on top of the amp, and > doesn’t get switched off. > I want a basic sound that’ll let me clean it up when I pull the volume > back, and when I open up the volume on the guitar, will get close to > say, Angus Young’s sound on Back in Black.

It has AC/DC gain level, and much, much more. Remember that the power section is single ended, and a small tube. The power distortion is a bit smoother than AC/DC, and without the thump. > Preferably something that > would be set, and left on 100% of the time.

Well, I just spent a couple of hours over the weekend using the CM as an amp. I’ve owned this unit for a few years, but a few observations from this weekend: I found a Mullard 12AX7 that sounds really good in the preamp hole, and I’ve been using a vintage Tung Sol 12AU7 in the power hole. Tube selection DOES make a difference. It sounds MUCH better with my Vintage 30 cab than either of my Hiwatt cabs. My favorite Hiwatt for Marshall is 16 ohms. The CM doesn’t really like 16 ohms. I have another Hiwatt that is 8 ohms, but it sounds a bit harsh through that cab. It is designed for 8 ohms, but I seem to get best results at FOUR ohms, and it seems to have the most output at 4. I’m not sure how hard I’m hitting my Tung Sol, but it sure does sound good. I used to just peg the master, and then turn up the gain (going after max power tube distortion). However, at least at four ohm load, it sounds better with the master rolled off a bit. I used to run preamp at two or below. However, with this particular Mullard, and master dialed back a bit, it sounds good at 12:00 and a little higher. BUT, it is quite noisy at higher settings. It really benefits from EQ and noise gate. EQ *after* the CM when driving another amp. > If I need any distortion > beyond that, I could supplement it with a pedal.

I can’t imagine any guitar *needing* a pedal with the CM. It is very gainy. > Of course, the whole purpose of this is to have a light weight and > portable rig with controllable volume.

That, it will do. And it’ll impress fellow guitarists. It’s very small, but has big tone (considering the tiny output transformer). > Otherwise I’d just buy a Plexi > half stack

Well, a properly set up JMP 2204 into the right speakers also sounds very good at low volumes. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> ~jp

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > You guys but all this high tech.expensive equipment and hook it all > together to try and get the sound thats sitting right in front of your > eyes in one enclosure. You can laugh and scoff and shell out all the > money you want . I spent $130 on a 1966 Harmony H410 that’ll overdrive > like butter or clean up slicker than a whistle. I changed the coupling > caps to .1 mfd,disconnnected the tremolo,added a 10" alnico speaker (in > the same cabinet ) to go along with the Jensen 8" alnico that was in > it. It had 3 input jacks so I got rid of one and stuck a pot in its > place to control the amount of power going into the other jack that I > wired to serve as a line out. To hell with micing anything. It uses a > single EL84 for the power section,a 12AU7 ( orX or T or Z or V ) for > the preamp and a 5Y3 for rectification. If you want to use pedals with > it then of course you can but I dont use anything but a delay/echo to > give the sound some depth. Why foul up tube beauty with a bunch of SS > state junk?.

Is that what you would’ve said to EVH in the late 70’s? He ran a Super Lead with a variac into a dummy load, then to SOLID STATE power amps. If you have the tone that you want, from a unit that uses TUBES in the output section, I am not opposed to using SS simply to boost the TUBE tone. > The whole sheebang tips the scales at a whopping 12 > pounds. It doesnt look like much and people may sneer at it when you > come trucking into a jam. They usually change their mind once its fired > up. Simplicities where its at. Old simplicity to be precise.

There are many ways to skin a cat. You found one, DeeAa found another. I also have a similar solution in my collection. I have a few single ended EL84 type amps that started life in reel to reel tape machines (that I modified for guitar). In reality, they are not totally unlike a beefier version of the Cream Machine! In fact, one of my unfinished projects is an amp that will use a STEREO single ended EL84 type from the reel to reel. You can run one side as a stand alone. Disconnect the speaker, it will engage a dummy load. It’ll have a variable line out after the OPT (like the Matchless Spitfire circuit). You will be able to drive that half of the stereo amp for power tube distortion, then use the variable line out to patch it to the other side of the power amp. Result = power tube distortion at LOW volumes (zero to about 8W). You can also run the line out to a bigger amp (tube or SS), for more volume. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I had this 100W PA monitor amp that has gain, volume and also bass and > treble settings plus jacks for line out and extra speaker and even two > inputs…and it was very small, built to fit inside an angled floor > monitor. > So I decided to mod a Marshall 4×10 cab by building this amp INTO the > speaker cab. > I did this by adding a 100W Eminence speaker for the PA amp, while the > cab > also has three original 10" Marshalls in it. Actually four, but the > extra > one is hidden inside the cab. > Now I can put my Cream machine on top of it, and the CM drives the 10" > speakers with all its mighty 5 W power, while I run a line from its Red > Box > line out to the poweramp, and get 100W more headroom and punch from the > same > enclosure! While I was at it, I also added some padding in the cab to > cut > the shrillness of the 4×10" a little, and also put some sound > dissipators in > front of the speaker cones to lessen projectivity. > So now the tiny tube amp gives me the highs 100% tube at up to 100dB, > and > the SS power section and the 12" Eminence pumps out the lows the tiny > amp > can’t. > This way I can run the setup at very little volume and still sound like > a > cranked Plexi, but I also have enough punch to play with drums etc. too > if > needed, and have the bag end and headroom too. And all I need to lug > around > is the 4×10" or now a 3×10"/1×12" 195W cab which is not huge at all, > and the > guitar in whose bag pocket the CM easily slips. Very little gear to > lug! > Also, if I want to, I can use my JMP-1 or a Tech-21 or any preamp and > run > that into the SS power section instead of the CM, AND I can still use > the > 10" speakers too by in that case sending them a signal from the extra > speaker jack of the PA amp. OR, when they become available here, I’m > perhaps > going to start using a Epiphone Valve Junior head to drive the 10" > speakers, > I think. > And because the PA amp has all the EQ and gain etc. controls needed, > it’s > really easy to adjust its sound too, since the CM only has volume and > gain. > It’s a funny amp – made by Solton – doesn’t seem to clip no matter how > you > drive it, I mean, it doesn’t clip ugly like an SS amp at all…built to > take > the feedback and abuse like a floor monitor. > Now all I need is add some wheels to the cab…I’ll try to get some > photos > on the net later! I’ll even try to get some sounds maybe or video. > Cheers, > Dee

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->The Cream Machine was built specifically to sound like a cranked >Marshall. You will never get a pure clean tone out of it. For months, >I’ve been running a 12AU7 in the preamp, but that really gives you more >of a blues distortion, still NOT really clean. Last week, I put a >Mullard 12ax7 back into the preamp hole, and it just sounds better. >If you want a low power CLEAN tube amp, the Cream Machine is NOT for >you. If you want a cranked Marshall tone, it is a great little unit. >It sounds really good into Vintage 30 speakers, also. > Hmm… Well, I guess I should’ve asked more questions the first time > around. Does it clean up fairly well when you roll your guitar’s > volume back? > I’m not looking for something with seperate, defined clean and cranked > sounds. I’m looking to emulate the non-master volume vibe, and have > the ability to pull back the volume for "almost" clean. Not "Twin > Reverb on 3" clean. > Right now, while sitting around at home in the apartment, I play > through a Vibro Champ with a Tone Bone Hot British in front of it–the > Tone Bone is connected with a 2ft cord, sits on top of the amp, and > doesn’t get switched off. > I want a basic sound that’ll let me clean it up when I pull the volume > back, and when I open up the volume on the guitar, will get close to > say, Angus Young’s sound on Back in Black. Preferably something that > would be set, and left on 100% of the time. If I need any distortion > beyond that, I could supplement it with a pedal. > Of course, the whole purpose of this is to have a light weight and > portable rig with controllable volume. Otherwise I’d just buy a Plexi > half stack > ~jp

Check out the post about the Blues Master on ebay. If you want more clean headroom, you might like it better.

Response:

1. You’re sick. 2. I hate you*. 3. I want one one those! — Thad *Only because I’m eaten up with jealousy.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> DeeAa… I’m curious, what (if anything) are you using for EQ in this > setup? I’m interested in the Cream Machine, as what you’re doing now > is very close to what I’ve wanted to do for years. > In my case, I have a 100W solid state power amp that was the power > section from an old Fender Rhodes keyboard. I’ll save the details of > me and a high school buddy destroying the original cab, but regardless, > I still have the amp. I also got a HUGE 2×12 cab years ago. It’s like > the size of a Fender Showman cab, and I cut a square hole in one end to > mount that power amp in the same way it was mounted in the Rhodes cab. > So there…I have a powered, bigass 2×12 cab doing nothing. :-D Maybe > I can start using it for something… I noticed you said the CM has a > lot of gain. How clean can you get it? Do you think substituting the > "preamp" 12AX7 for a 12AU7 or 12AT7 tame it a bit?

Hello Jon, I think it was Jim who suggested changing the tubes to 12AU7, or at least one of them, and that does work very well in the 2nd position, which I gather is the ‘power amp’ tube. It gives a much more poweramp-type sound since it doesn’t saturate like a 12AX7. He’s got lotsa experience with the CM. It might be a tube issue, but I find that using two AU7’s makes the sound very cold, albeit much clearer – however the lack of that warm saturation makes it sound thin too. So the first one is a an AX7 for me. And using that, well, the unit really can’t do clean sounds at all, it’s pretty crunchy all the time. I do get acceptable dirty-clean sound by using a singlecoil and dropping the guitar volume a bit, but it’s nowhere near ‘clean’ anyway. But basically what CM can do well is hotrod-cranked plexi; quite biting and high-rangey but singing, screaming sound. And nothing else almost. As for EQ, I don’t really use one, although the poweramp does have treble and bass knobs. I’ve ‘EQ’ed all my guitars with a tone pot and a suitable capacitor there, and the rest comes from the cab, i.e. it can’t reproduce the highest sounds anyway, having no tweeter or horn but just 10" and 12" speakers. So I think you’d do fine even without an EQ. But if you’d like to use it for recording, you really need a HUSH unit or something, the thing is pretty noisey. I’m looking for a small pedal to do that currently, don’t know if there are any good and cheap ones available, but my old HUSH 3 19" unit seems to be broken or gone bad somehow. Cheers, Dee p.s. I experimented last night by dividing the signal in two via a chorus before the CM and amp, and drove the 10" with the CM and the poweramp thru a Tech21 pedal also (the poweramp has 2 inputs), and if I set both to very similar AC/DC-esque settings, it sounded really good too, mixed the two sounds surprisingly well. So I’m podering about trying various combinations too…

Response:

> The Cream Machine was built specifically to sound like a cranked Marshall. > You will never get a pure clean tone out of it. For months, I’ve been > running a 12AU7 in the preamp, but that really gives you more of a blues > distortion, still NOT really clean. Last week, I put a Mullard 12ax7 back > into the preamp hole, and it just sounds better. > If you want a low power CLEAN tube amp, the Cream Machine is NOT for you. > If you want a cranked Marshall tone, it is a great little unit. It sounds > really good into Vintage 30 speakers, also.

Exactly!

Response:

> Over the weekend, I was enjoying my Cream Machine into my Vintage 30 cab. > The Cream Machine is only about 1 true watt, but Vintage 30’s are so > efficient that it is still about as loud as I usually play the 2204!

Heu, You said the CM liked 4 ohms pretty well…how did that go again; if I have a 4×12" with 4 8ohm speakers, the two are in series and then the pairs are parallel; that gives a total of 8. But how did it go again? is it like in series the resistance drops, so 4 ohms in parallel again creates 8 ohms? or was it the other way ’round? Too early in the morning my brain don’t work. But if I rip off one speaker, leaving two 8 ohm speakers in series and a single 8 ohm speaker, does that change it to, what, 12 ohms? Hmm….How could one drop the resistance of 4 8-ohm speakers to 4 ohms? Maybe just using the 2 speakers in series?

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> You guys but all this high tech.expensive equipment and hook it all > together to try and get the sound thats sitting right in front of your > eyes in one enclosure. You can laugh and scoff and shell out all the > money you want . I spent $130 on a 1966 Harmony H410 that’ll overdrive > like butter or clean up slicker than a whistle. I changed the coupling > caps to .1 mfd,disconnnected the tremolo,added a 10" alnico speaker (in > the same cabinet ) to go along with the Jensen 8" alnico that was in > it. It had 3 input jacks so I got rid of one and stuck a pot in its > place to control the amount of power going into the other jack that I > wired to serve as a line out. To hell with micing anything. It uses a > single EL84 for the power section,a 12AU7 ( orX or T or Z or V ) for > the preamp and a 5Y3 for rectification. If you want to use pedals with > it then of course you can but I dont use anything but a delay/echo to > give the sound some depth. Why foul up tube beauty with a bunch of SS > state junk?. The whole sheebang tips the scales at a whopping 12 > pounds. It doesnt look like much and people may sneer at it when you > come trucking into a jam. They usually change their mind once its fired > up. Simplicities where its at. Old simplicity to be precise.

Sounds like a sweet one! But where’d I find something like that? Can’t even find moderately priced Marshall tube amps here, let alone vintage ones

Response:

> I dont know Jim. He stated somewhere plain as day that he was using an > SS power section. After looking at the Cream Machines specs I see it > uses a preamp tube as a power tube?

Yes. 12AU7 for about a watt. > Get outta town man. If they would > have used an EL34 their product might have been worth looking into.

Before rejecting it, HAVE YOU PLAYED ONE??? An EL34 would defeat the purpose of the Cream Machine, because it would put out too much power and be too loud. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Either way DeeAa . Like I said your playing would sound good through > anything you want to amplify it with. Theres plenty of options besides > 50 watt amps but you know what you want and what you’re doing. I’m not > going to try and convince a guy with your experience into doing > anything.. >It seems like you’ll be whipping a dead horse as long as you’re using >the tube preamp with a SS power amp. You’ve got it ass backwards >Bro. > Well, SOMEBODY has it "ass backwards," but it ain’t DeeAa. >You know what DeeAa? You’re at the level as a guitar player >and musician that you’d sound good playing through anything. > You’d >sound better with a tube power amp and SS preamp though. > The Cream Machine HAS a tube power amp. Single ended 12AU7, with a > small output transformer. When you use it as a preamp, you’re still > using the power amp section of the Cream Machine. …not unlike early > EVH, but on a smaller scale. >I had this 100W PA monitor amp that has gain, volume and also bass > and >treble settings plus jacks for line out and extra speaker and even > two >inputs…and it was very small, built to fit inside an angled floor >monitor. >So I decided to mod a Marshall 4×10 cab by building this amp INTO the >speaker cab. >I did this by adding a 100W Eminence speaker for the PA amp, while > the >cab >also has three original 10" Marshalls in it. Actually four, but the >extra >one is hidden inside the cab. >Now I can put my Cream machine on top of it, and the CM drives the > 10" >speakers with all its mighty 5 W power, while I run a line from its > Red >Box >line out to the poweramp, and get 100W more headroom and punch from > the >same >enclosure! While I was at it, I also added some padding in the cab to >cut >the shrillness of the 4×10" a little, and also put some sound >dissipators in >front of the speaker cones to lessen projectivity. >So now the tiny tube amp gives me the highs 100% tube at up to 100dB, >and >the SS power section and the 12" Eminence pumps out the lows the tiny >amp >can’t. >This way I can run the setup at very little volume and still sound > like >a >cranked Plexi, but I also have enough punch to play with drums etc. > too >if >needed, and have the bag end and headroom too. And all I need to lug >around >is the 4×10" or now a 3×10"/1×12" 195W cab which is not huge at all, >and the >guitar in whose bag pocket the CM easily slips. Very little gear to >lug! >Also, if I want to, I can use my JMP-1 or a Tech-21 or any preamp and >run >that into the SS power section instead of the CM, AND I can still use >the >10" speakers too by in that case sending them a signal from the extra >speaker jack of the PA amp. OR, when they become available here, I’m >perhaps >going to start using a Epiphone Valve Junior head to drive the 10" >speakers, >I think. >And because the PA amp has all the EQ and gain etc. controls needed, >it’s >really easy to adjust its sound too, since the CM only has volume and >gain. >It’s a funny amp – made by Solton – doesn’t seem to clip no matter > how >you >drive it, I mean, it doesn’t clip ugly like an SS amp at all…built > to >take >the feedback and abuse like a floor monitor. >Now all I need is add some wheels to the cab…I’ll try to get some >photos >on the net later! I’ll even try to get some sounds maybe or video. >Cheers, >Dee

Response:

>>Over the weekend, I was enjoying my Cream Machine into my Vintage 30 cab. >The Cream Machine is only about 1 true watt, but Vintage 30’s are so >efficient that it is still about as loud as I usually play the 2204! > Heu, > You said the CM liked 4 ohms pretty well.

So far, so good. ..how did that go again; if I have > a 4×12" with 4 8ohm speakers, the two are in series and then the pairs are > parallel; that gives a total of 8. But how did it go again? is it like in > series the resistance drops,

Series adds for resistance. so 4 ohms in parallel again creates 8 ohms? or > was it the other way ’round?

Yep. Too early in the morning my brain don’t work. > But if I rip off one speaker, leaving two 8 ohm speakers in series and a > single 8 ohm speaker, does that change it to, what, 12 ohms? Hmm….How > could one drop the resistance of 4 8-ohm speakers to 4 ohms? Maybe just > using the 2 speakers in series?

No, using two 8 ohm in parallel would be four ohms.

Response:

fender pickup repair

admin — Tue, 11 Apr 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Below is a copy of a reply I posted elsewhere in this forum: If Anyone knows of contact info for Abigail Yberra (Fender employee) Please contact me. I would sincerely like to contact her and hopefully send the pickup in question to her and have it repaired. If she decides to turn down the request then I will gldly accept her decision, and not that of the Fender"GUY" with the bad attitude as described below. It would be greatly appreciated bot by me as well as my customer who has invested a fair amount in the instrument. Thanks Sincerely] Rainer Wiechmann Guitar Works London, ON <>

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Below is a copy of a reply I posted elsewhere in this forum: > If Anyone knows of contact info for Abigail Yberra (Fender employee) > Please contact me. I would sincerely like to contact her and hopefully > send the pickup in question to her and have it repaired. If she decides > to turn down the request then I will gldly accept her decision, and not > that of the Fender"GUY" with the bad attitude as described below. > It would be greatly appreciated bot by me as well as my customer who has > invested a fair amount in the instrument. > Thanks > Sincerely] > Rainer Wiechmann > Guitar Works > London, ON > < dealer, although my business is essentially independent of the > dealership. I called Fender CA two days ago in order to service a > customer of mine who has a completely original 1959 Fender strat that > has been appraised at nearly $30K. My customer is a collector and to > this point has been highly respectful of Fender instruments and the > investment they represent. > The Strat in question has a dead neck pickup that was working until > recently. I determined that the problem was within the coil itself and > cannot be corrected in any way other than to rewind the pickup. I > decided the best course of action would be to contact Fender Custom shop > and comission Abigail Yberra to personally rewind the pickup, since in > all likelyhood she wound it originally. I would send the pickup to them, > and willingly pay whatever the expense, since even $800 to $1000 would > be worth retaining the originality of the instrument. > The person I spoke to at customer service was very enthusiastic & > helpful, stating that it would be great to have this done, and there > should be no problem, etc. He proceeded to connect me to a "tech" at the > Custom Shop. > This is where I met with the "Corporate Attitute"…….Here’s what I > was told after briefly describing the situation. > "we’re not in the business of maintaining vintage guitar values…it is > not a service we offer to anyone, we have to draw the line > somewhere….we’re in the business of selling NEW guitars, and we don’t > even sell custom shop replacement parts to owners of custom shop > instruments." (almost verbatim to the best of my recollection) > You mean to tell me that if Eric Clapton called up wanting a replacement > neck for "Blackie" #2, he would be told to bugger off….we will get you > a new guitar, but forget about getting a part for your old one? Not very > likely…I was, and am totally pissed off at this guy’s smug attitude. > Having Abigail rewind the pickup would maintain the originality and > value of the guitar….even if Seymour Duncan were to do the job, the > value of the guitar would likely drop several thousand $. …my customer > is very disappointed to say the least. This is the level of "service" > Fender is willing to provide, even to individuals who respect the > historic value of instruments that they themselves don’t seem to give a > rat’s ass about. > I sincerely wish there was a way for me to contcat Abbie directly….I > would be more than willing to send the pickup to her, pay her directly > and be done with this…..I am sure she could probaly use a couple of > hundred$ in her pocket to do this simple job. Fender dude said " > Abigail is not available for this kind of work"….What"???? who the > hell is he to decide whether or not she could use e few extra dollars > Anyone out there who has any thoughts on this, please let me know……I > know that I will be very reluctant to endorse the Fender Product from > here on in….only because this "corporate BULLSHIT mentality" has > really soured my perception of what the product once meant to me. I can > not proudly represent a company that cares solely about the bottom line > at the end of the day, and turns it’s back on customeres, dealers and > service people alike. It’s no wonder dealers are pissed…. > sincerely > R Wiechmann>>

Hmmm, You mean rewound Pup will be equal to original? She may be vintage but do they use vintage wire too? Witn redone Pup that guitar is nor original any more no matter what. My two bits.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Below is a copy of a reply I posted elsewhere in this forum: > If Anyone knows of contact info for Abigail Yberra (Fender employee) > Please contact me. I would sincerely like to contact her and hopefully > send the pickup in question to her and have it repaired. If she decides > to turn down the request then I will gldly accept her decision, and not > that of the Fender"GUY" with the bad attitude as described below. > It would be greatly appreciated bot by me as well as my customer who has > invested a fair amount in the instrument. > Thanks > Sincerely] > Rainer Wiechmann > Guitar Works > London, ON > < dealer, although my business is essentially independent of the > dealership. I called Fender CA two days ago in order to service a > customer of mine who has a completely original 1959 Fender strat that > has been appraised at nearly $30K. My customer is a collector and to > this point has been highly respectful of Fender instruments and the > investment they represent. > The Strat in question has a dead neck pickup that was working until > recently. I determined that the problem was within the coil itself and > cannot be corrected in any way other than to rewind the pickup. I > decided the best course of action would be to contact Fender Custom shop > and comission Abigail Yberra to personally rewind the pickup, since in > all likelyhood she wound it originally. I would send the pickup to them, > and willingly pay whatever the expense, since even $800 to $1000 would > be worth retaining the originality of the instrument. > The person I spoke to at customer service was very enthusiastic & > helpful, stating that it would be great to have this done, and there > should be no problem, etc. He proceeded to connect me to a "tech" at the > Custom Shop. > This is where I met with the "Corporate Attitute"…….Here’s what I > was told after briefly describing the situation. > "we’re not in the business of maintaining vintage guitar values…it is > not a service we offer to anyone, we have to draw the line > somewhere….we’re in the business of selling NEW guitars, and we don’t > even sell custom shop replacement parts to owners of custom shop > instruments." (almost verbatim to the best of my recollection) > You mean to tell me that if Eric Clapton called up wanting a replacement > neck for "Blackie" #2, he would be told to bugger off….we will get you > a new guitar, but forget about getting a part for your old one? Not very > likely…I was, and am totally pissed off at this guy’s smug attitude. > Having Abigail rewind the pickup would maintain the originality and > value of the guitar….even if Seymour Duncan were to do the job, the > value of the guitar would likely drop several thousand $. …my customer > is very disappointed to say the least. This is the level of "service" > Fender is willing to provide, even to individuals who respect the > historic value of instruments that they themselves don’t seem to give a > rat’s ass about. > I sincerely wish there was a way for me to contcat Abbie directly….I > would be more than willing to send the pickup to her, pay her directly > and be done with this…..I am sure she could probaly use a couple of > hundred$ in her pocket to do this simple job. Fender dude said " > Abigail is not available for this kind of work"….What"???? who the > hell is he to decide whether or not she could use e few extra dollars > Anyone out there who has any thoughts on this, please let me know……I > know that I will be very reluctant to endorse the Fender Product from > here on in….only because this "corporate BULLSHIT mentality" has > really soured my perception of what the product once meant to me. I can > not proudly represent a company that cares solely about the bottom line > at the end of the day, and turns it’s back on customeres, dealers and > service people alike. It’s no wonder dealers are pissed…. > sincerely > R Wiechmann>>

Mr. Al Guzman VP Manufacturing Fender Musical Insts. 311 Cessna Circle Corona, CA, 91720 Please five Al my regards. Marc Mulay

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Below is a copy of a reply I posted elsewhere in this forum: > If Anyone knows of contact info for Abigail Yberra (Fender employee) > Please contact me. I would sincerely like to contact her and hopefully > send the pickup in question to her and have it repaired. If she decides > to turn down the request then I will gldly accept her decision, and not > that of the Fender"GUY" with the bad attitude as described below. > It would be greatly appreciated bot by me as well as my customer who has > invested a fair amount in the instrument. > Thanks > Sincerely] > Rainer Wiechmann > Guitar Works > London, ON > < dealer, although my business is essentially independent of the > dealership. I called Fender CA two days ago in order to service a > customer of mine who has a completely original 1959 Fender strat that > has been appraised at nearly $30K. My customer is a collector and to > this point has been highly respectful of Fender instruments and the > investment they represent. > The Strat in question has a dead neck pickup that was working until > recently. I determined that the problem was within the coil itself and > cannot be corrected in any way other than to rewind the pickup. I > decided the best course of action would be to contact Fender Custom shop > and comission Abigail Yberra to personally rewind the pickup, since in > all likelyhood she wound it originally. I would send the pickup to them, > and willingly pay whatever the expense, since even $800 to $1000 would > be worth retaining the originality of the instrument. > The person I spoke to at customer service was very enthusiastic & > helpful, stating that it would be great to have this done, and there > should be no problem, etc. He proceeded to connect me to a "tech" at the > Custom Shop. > This is where I met with the "Corporate Attitute"…….Here’s what I > was told after briefly describing the situation. > "we’re not in the business of maintaining vintage guitar values…it is > not a service we offer to anyone, we have to draw the line > somewhere….we’re in the business of selling NEW guitars, and we don’t > even sell custom shop replacement parts to owners of custom shop > instruments." (almost verbatim to the best of my recollection) > You mean to tell me that if Eric Clapton called up wanting a replacement > neck for "Blackie" #2, he would be told to bugger off….we will get you > a new guitar, but forget about getting a part for your old one? Not very > likely…I was, and am totally pissed off at this guy’s smug attitude. > Having Abigail rewind the pickup would maintain the originality and > value of the guitar….even if Seymour Duncan were to do the job, the > value of the guitar would likely drop several thousand $. …my customer > is very disappointed to say the least. This is the level of "service" > Fender is willing to provide, even to individuals who respect the > historic value of instruments that they themselves don’t seem to give a > rat’s ass about. > I sincerely wish there was a way for me to contcat Abbie directly….I > would be more than willing to send the pickup to her, pay her directly > and be done with this…..I am sure she could probaly use a couple of > hundred$ in her pocket to do this simple job. Fender dude said " > Abigail is not available for this kind of work"….What"???? who the > hell is he to decide whether or not she could use e few extra dollars > Anyone out there who has any thoughts on this, please let me know……I > know that I will be very reluctant to endorse the Fender Product from > here on in….only because this "corporate BULLSHIT mentality" has > really soured my perception of what the product once meant to me. I can > not proudly represent a company that cares solely about the bottom line > at the end of the day, and turns it’s back on customeres, dealers and > service people alike. It’s no wonder dealers are pissed…. > sincerely > R Wiechmann>>

And,…. there you go. Yet. just another example why the TRIPLE GOLD RATED *Ex-SERVICE CENTER* Said *NO*, to working for a company that is out of touch with THEIR past customers. THIS, is what I had to deal with as a Fender Service Center of decades. Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of So, here are your options, as I have been in this place many times. Find the break in the winding, and tie it off. Chances are the break is in the first top layers. If the starting side of the winding is the problem, an ohm meter reading can confirm this, you can micro solder the break, if it is between the tie off point and the coil. If that break is within the coil, you are cooked. You have no choice but to re-wind the pickup. So, here’s what you do. You call John Suhr, and tell him I sent you. http://www.suhrguitars.com/ Get back to me if there is any problem. Regards, Rich Koerner, Time Electronics. http://www.timeelect.com Specialists in Live Sound FOH Engineering, Music & Studio Production, Vintage Instruments, and Tube Amplifiers

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Below is a copy of a reply I posted elsewhere in this forum: > If Anyone knows of contact info for Abigail Yberra (Fender employee) > Please contact me. I would sincerely like to contact her and hopefully > send the pickup in question to her and have it repaired. If she decides > to turn down the request then I will gldly accept her decision, and not > that of the Fender"GUY" with the bad attitude as described below. > It would be greatly appreciated bot by me as well as my customer who has > invested a fair amount in the instrument. > Thanks > Sincerely] > Rainer Wiechmann > Guitar Works > London, ON > < dealer, although my business is essentially independent of the > dealership. I called Fender CA two days ago in order to service a > customer of mine who has a completely original 1959 Fender strat that > has been appraised at nearly $30K. My customer is a collector and to > this point has been highly respectful of Fender instruments and the > investment they represent. > The Strat in question has a dead neck pickup that was working until > recently. I determined that the problem was within the coil itself and > cannot be corrected in any way other than to rewind the pickup. I > decided the best course of action would be to contact Fender Custom shop > and comission Abigail Yberra to personally rewind the pickup, since in > all likelyhood she wound it originally. I would send the pickup to them, > and willingly pay whatever the expense, since even $800 to $1000 would > be worth retaining the originality of the instrument. > The person I spoke to at customer service was very enthusiastic & > helpful, stating that it would be great to have this done, and there > should be no problem, etc. He proceeded to connect me to a "tech" at the > Custom Shop. > This is where I met with the "Corporate Attitute"…….Here’s what I > was told after briefly describing the situation. > "we’re not in the business of maintaining vintage guitar values…it is > not a service we offer to anyone, we have to draw the line > somewhere….we’re in the business of selling NEW guitars, and we don’t > even sell custom shop replacement parts to owners of custom shop > instruments." (almost verbatim to the best of my recollection) > You mean to tell me that if Eric Clapton called up wanting a replacement > neck for "Blackie" #2, he would be told to bugger off….we will get you > a new guitar, but forget about getting a part for your old one? Not very > likely…I was, and am totally pissed off at this guy’s smug attitude. > Having Abigail rewind the pickup would maintain the originality and > value of the guitar….even if Seymour Duncan were to do the job, the > value of the guitar would likely drop several thousand $. …my customer > is very disappointed to say the least. This is the level of "service" > Fender is willing to provide, even to individuals who respect the > historic value of instruments that they themselves don’t seem to give a > rat’s ass about. > I sincerely wish there was a way for me to contcat Abbie directly….I > would be more than willing to send the pickup to her, pay her directly > and be done with this…..I am sure she could probaly use a couple of > hundred$ in her pocket to do this simple job. Fender dude said " > Abigail is not available for this kind of work"….What"???? who the > hell is he to decide whether or not she could use e few extra dollars > Anyone out there who has any thoughts on this, please let me know……I > know that I will be very reluctant to endorse the Fender Product from > here on in….only because this "corporate BULLSHIT mentality" has > really soured my perception of what the product once meant to me. I can > not proudly represent a company that cares solely about the bottom line > at the end of the day, and turns it’s back on customeres, dealers and > service people alike. It’s no wonder dealers are pissed…. > sincerely > R Wiechmann>> > Mr. Al Guzman > VP Manufacturing > Fender Musical Insts. > 311 Cessna Circle > Corona, CA, 91720 > Please five Al my regards. Marc Mulay

Why should anyone have to call Al. This should be a FACTORY SERVICE POLICY *across the board* If anything, ask Al, if you can get through the telephone menus, what gives with the not being in If EVERYONE has to call Al to get things done over there, that phone will have to be surgically removed from his freaking head every week. Yeah, piss Al off, with ALL the calls. I may put up a page just to create such a problem for Al, and the person in the same position over at Gibson to funnel comments of this type to their respective ears. Well, that’s till their respective firewalls go up over there, and they either give someone in customer the job of dealing with it. Regards, Rich Koerner, Time Electronics. http://www.timeelect.com Specialists in Live Sound FOH Engineering, Music & Studio Production, Vintage Instruments, and Tube Amplifiers

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Below is a copy of a reply I posted elsewhere in this forum: > If Anyone knows of contact info for Abigail Yberra (Fender employee) > Please contact me. I would sincerely like to contact her and hopefully > send the pickup in question to her and have it repaired. If she decides > to turn down the request then I will gldly accept her decision, and not > that of the Fender"GUY" with the bad attitude as described below. > It would be greatly appreciated bot by me as well as my customer who has > invested a fair amount in the instrument. > Thanks > Sincerely] > Rainer Wiechmann > Guitar Works > London, ON > < dealer, although my business is essentially independent of the > dealership. I called Fender CA two days ago in order to service a > customer of mine who has a completely original 1959 Fender strat that > has been appraised at nearly $30K. My customer is a collector and to > this point has been highly respectful of Fender instruments and the > investment they represent. > The Strat in question has a dead neck pickup that was working until > recently. I determined that the problem was within the coil itself and > cannot be corrected in any way other than to rewind the pickup. I > decided the best course of action would be to contact Fender Custom shop > and comission Abigail Yberra to personally rewind the pickup, since in > all likelyhood she wound it originally. I would send the pickup to them, > and willingly pay whatever the expense, since even $800 to $1000 would > be worth retaining the originality of the instrument. > The person I spoke to at customer service was very enthusiastic & > helpful, stating that it would be great to have this done, and there > should be no problem, etc. He proceeded to connect me to a "tech" at the > Custom Shop. > This is where I met with the "Corporate Attitute"…….Here’s what I > was told after briefly describing the situation. > "we’re not in the business of maintaining vintage guitar values…it is > not a service we offer to anyone, we have to draw the line > somewhere….we’re in the business of selling NEW guitars, and we don’t > even sell custom shop replacement parts to owners of custom shop > instruments." (almost verbatim to the best of my recollection) > You mean to tell me that if Eric Clapton called up wanting a replacement > neck for "Blackie" #2, he would be told to bugger off….we will get you > a new guitar, but forget about getting a part for your old one? Not very > likely…I was, and am totally pissed off at this guy’s smug attitude. > Having Abigail rewind the pickup would maintain the originality and > value of the guitar….even if Seymour Duncan were to do the job, the > value of the guitar would likely drop several thousand $. …my customer > is very disappointed to say the least. This is the level of "service" > Fender is willing to provide, even to individuals who respect the > historic value of instruments that they themselves don’t seem to give a > rat’s ass about. > I sincerely wish there was a way for me to contcat Abbie directly….I > would be more than willing to send the pickup to her, pay her directly > and be done with this…..I am sure she could probaly use a couple of > hundred$ in her pocket to do this simple job. Fender dude said " > Abigail is not available for this kind of work"….What"???? who the > hell is he to decide whether or not she could use e few extra dollars > Anyone out there who has any thoughts on this, please let me know……I > know that I will be very reluctant to endorse the Fender Product from > here on in….only because this "corporate BULLSHIT mentality" has > really soured my perception of what the product once meant to me. I can > not proudly represent a company that cares solely about the bottom line > at the end of the day, and turns it’s back on customeres, dealers and > service people alike. It’s no wonder dealers are pissed…. > sincerely > R Wiechmann>>

It can’t hurt to try contacting her, but keep in mind that this woman has been at Fender since the late 50’s. If she started there when she was 20 years old, she’s probably somewhere between 65-70 years old: http://www.fender.com/news/index.php?display_article=19 Do you really think she’s going to want to do freelance work after winding pickups all day? She might, but I don’t think it’s likely. I work as a web designer and I like what I do for a living, but I cringe every time someone I know asks me if I would want to do some freelance work for them – their personal web site, the kid’s cubscout web site, etc – even with a fair payment for the work. But, that’s me.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Below is a copy of a reply I posted elsewhere in this forum: > If Anyone knows of contact info for Abigail Yberra (Fender employee) > Please contact me. I would sincerely like to contact her and hopefully > send the pickup in question to her and have it repaired. If she decides > to turn down the request then I will gldly accept her decision, and not > that of the Fender"GUY" with the bad attitude as described below. > It would be greatly appreciated bot by me as well as my customer who has > invested a fair amount in the instrument. > Thanks > Sincerely] > Rainer Wiechmann > Guitar Works > London, ON > < dealer, although my business is essentially independent of the > dealership. I called Fender CA two days ago in order to service a > customer of mine who has a completely original 1959 Fender strat that > has been appraised at nearly $30K. My customer is a collector and to > this point has been highly respectful of Fender instruments and the > investment they represent. > The Strat in question has a dead neck pickup that was working until > recently. I determined that the problem was within the coil itself and > cannot be corrected in any way other than to rewind the pickup. I > decided the best course of action would be to contact Fender Custom shop > and comission Abigail Yberra to personally rewind the pickup, since in > all likelyhood she wound it originally. I would send the pickup to them, > and willingly pay whatever the expense, since even $800 to $1000 would > be worth retaining the originality of the instrument. > The person I spoke to at customer service was very enthusiastic & > helpful, stating that it would be great to have this done, and there > should be no problem, etc. He proceeded to connect me to a "tech" at the > Custom Shop. > This is where I met with the "Corporate Attitute"…….Here’s what I > was told after briefly describing the situation. > "we’re not in the business of maintaining vintage guitar values…it is > not a service we offer to anyone, we have to draw the line > somewhere….we’re in the business of selling NEW guitars, and we don’t > even sell custom shop replacement parts to owners of custom shop > instruments." (almost verbatim to the best of my recollection) > You mean to tell me that if Eric Clapton called up wanting a replacement > neck for "Blackie" #2, he would be told to bugger off….we will get you > a new guitar, but forget about getting a part for your old one? Not very > likely…I was, and am totally pissed off at this guy’s smug attitude. > Having Abigail rewind the pickup would maintain the originality and > value of the guitar….even if Seymour Duncan were to do the job, the > value of the guitar would likely drop several thousand $. …my customer > is very disappointed to say the least. This is the level of "service" > Fender is willing to provide, even to individuals who respect the > historic value of instruments that they themselves don’t seem to give a > rat’s ass about. > I sincerely wish there was a way for me to contcat Abbie directly….I > would be more than willing to send the pickup to her, pay her directly > and be done with this…..I am sure she could probaly use a couple of > hundred$ in her pocket to do this simple job. Fender dude said " > Abigail is not available for this kind of work"….What"???? who the > hell is he to decide whether or not she could use e few extra dollars > Anyone out there who has any thoughts on this, please let me know……I > know that I will be very reluctant to endorse the Fender Product from > here on in….only because this "corporate BULLSHIT mentality" has > really soured my perception of what the product once meant to me. I can > not proudly represent a company that cares solely about the bottom line > at the end of the day, and turns it’s back on customeres, dealers and > service people alike. It’s no wonder dealers are pissed…. > sincerely > R Wiechmann>> > And,…. there you go. > Yet. just another example why the TRIPLE GOLD RATED *Ex-SERVICE CENTER* Said *NO*, to working for a > company that is out of touch with THEIR past customers. > THIS, is what I had to deal with as a Fender Service Center of decades. > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of

Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why people expect this level of service from Fender.

Response:

> > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why > people expect this level of service from Fender.

Fender and GM are two different things. GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. GM does not RI their cars. GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or Go ahead. Get some from them. But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. Regards, Rich Koerner, Time Electronics. http://www.timeelect.com Specialists in Live Sound FOH Engineering, Music & Studio Production, Vintage Instruments, and Tube Amplifiers

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why > people expect this level of service from Fender. >Fender and GM are two different things. >GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. >GM does not RI their cars. >GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. >Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or >Go ahead. Get some from them. >But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. >Regards, >Rich Koerner, >Time Electronics. >http://www.timeelect.com >Specialists in Live Sound FOH Engineering, > Music & Studio Production, >Vintage Instruments, and Tube Amplifiers

Now I’m upset that I can’t buy a Dillion coffee cup! — That man was a successful encyclopaedia salesman. –Head of Careers Advisory Board

Response:

> Find the break in the winding, and tie it off. > Chances are the break is in the first top layers.

Yes, I’ve done this too. With luck the break is in the top layer (or may even be a bad solder joint at an eyelet) You find the break, unwind some wire to get some slack and reconnect to the body of the coil wire bypassing the broken (short) part. Yes you loose a few turns but it usually doesn’t make a serious difference. This can be a big saviour on a classic part. But as I hinted above, be sure to test the coil continuity by scraping the wire and testing the actual coil rather than from the external wires. Also you can test the outer layer for breaks by testing ohms from the wire going to the center of the coil and then connecting a lead to a razor blade. Use the blade to go through the varnish to the copper to try to find a place where you are behind the break if you can. If none of that works you can actually unwind the coil to find the break and wind it back on, but that still isn’t the same as a true vintage coil. Only other option for such a valuable guitar is to by another true vintage working pickup from the era. Benj

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why > people expect this level of service from Fender. > Fender and GM are two different things. > GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. > GM does not RI their cars. > GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. > Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or > Go ahead. Get some from them. > But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it.

Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a thing when GM is not.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of > > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know > > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy > > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors > > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract > > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, > > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why > > people expect this level of service from Fender. > Fender and GM are two different things. > GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. > GM does not RI their cars. > GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. > Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or > Go ahead. Get some from them. > But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. >Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not >the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on >a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a >thing when GM is not.

Well, they probably *should* to maintain good relations with musicians. And this kind of thing tends to come to the public’s attention. Trouble is the OP talked to someone in a corporation who didn’t want anything that wasn’t part of daily routine to happen. If he had talked to someone else, things might have been different. But there are a lot of great pickup companies right now who rewind pickups. Things actually couldn’t be better in that regard IMO. Pete — That man was a successful encyclopaedia salesman. –Head of Careers Advisory Board

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> > > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of >> > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know >> > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy >> > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors >> > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract >> > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, >> > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why >> > people expect this level of service from Fender. >> Fender and GM are two different things. >> GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. >> GM does not RI their cars. >> GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. >> Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or >> Go ahead. Get some from them. >> But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. >Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not >the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on >a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a >thing when GM is not. > Well, they probably *should* to maintain good relations with > musicians. And this kind of thing tends to come to the public’s > attention. > Trouble is the OP talked to someone in a corporation who didn’t want > anything that wasn’t part of daily routine to happen. If he had > talked to someone else, things might have been different.

I think that Fender probably doesn’t want to get into it as they’re probably not set up for servicing instruments on a large scale. I think the question for them is where to draw the line. Okay, this fellow has a really nice 1959 Stratocaster that needs a pickup rewound and it would probably make for some nice PR piece if they did it and Abigail Ybarra did the work. But what about the guy with a 1978 Strat? Should he be able to have his guitar serviced? A 1966 Strat? A ‘94? I’m sure a *lot* of instruments and amplifiers have been sold in the time Fender has existed and it could become a really big production if they got into it which is probably why they don’t want to do it. > But there are a lot of great pickup companies right now who rewind > pickups. Things actually couldn’t be better in that regard IMO.

I agree 100%. I’m sure Abigail Ybarra does a great job winding pickups (she’s been doing it for long enough) and maybe there *is* something she does that makes a better sounding pickup but my opinion is that the whole thing is a marketing ploy by Fender. I’ve never tried a Ybarra pickup let alone compared it to any others, but that’s the feeling I get from the whole thing. Here is a quote by Caesar Diaz from an old issue of ToneQuest Report: * * * When I was at the Fender Custom Shop, I asked Abigail Ybarra if the winding machine was off in the counter. Her eyes got huge and she said, "How do you know that?" I said, "Well, I’ve taken a lot of pickups apart and I know that you wound them by turns, and I’ve seen published figures that so many turns equalled so much resistance." * * * Source: http://www.tonequest.com/pdf_pubs/samples/TQRDiaz.pdf So, in light of that, it confirms what most of us assumed or knew already in that older pickups haven’t been consistent over the years anyway. This is no fault of Abigail Ybarra’s; she has to work with equipment that is less than perfect. If she’s still using the same machine, it’s a hit or miss proposition. Let’s say that Fender retooled and got new winding machines and Ybarra is using those now – are you going to get back a pickup that sounded the way it did in the first place? Not likely; pickups may be more consistent from one to the other now but you have to ask *which* pickup is it on which they are now basing their standard. Building pickups doesn’t involve mojo, it’s a science and guys like Bill Lawrence and Jason Lollar have made it their entire career – and not just by winding the coils. However, the guy who wants the pickup wound by Ybarra does have a point in that the guitar will probably retain better value simply because the pickup would be rewound by *her.* A rewind or replacement by Lollar or one of the other guys could be better than the Ybarra rewind in every aspect including the way it sounds but that won’t matter because it’s the "mojo" that sells. But, I’m not coming from the view of a collector so my entire point may be moot anyway.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >> > > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of > >> > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know > >> > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy > >> > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors > >> > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract > >> > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, > >> > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why > >> > people expect this level of service from Fender. > >> Fender and GM are two different things. > >> GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. > >> GM does not RI their cars. > >> GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. > >> Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or > >> Go ahead. Get some from them. > >> But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. > >Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not > >the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on > >a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a > >thing when GM is not. > Well, they probably *should* to maintain good relations with > musicians. And this kind of thing tends to come to the public’s > attention. > Trouble is the OP talked to someone in a corporation who didn’t want > anything that wasn’t part of daily routine to happen. If he had > talked to someone else, things might have been different. >I think that Fender probably doesn’t want to get into it as they’re >probably not set up for servicing instruments on a large scale. I >think the question for them is where to draw the line. Okay, this >fellow has a really nice 1959 Stratocaster that needs a pickup rewound >and it would probably make for some nice PR piece if they did it and >Abigail Ybarra did the work.

Definitely. But you have to talk to the right person, who *knows* that something like that could not only bring good publicity to the company, but also make him look good for making it happen. And sometimes you have to know how to talk to people to get their cooperation. >But what about the guy with a 1978 Strat? Should he be able to have his guitar serviced?

Not worth the effort IMO. If a pickup in a ‘78 Fender goes bad, you replace it, probably with something that’s better. Use the same PU cover. >A 1966 Strat?

Send the pickup to a rewinder. >A ‘94?

Replace it with an aftermarket PU. >I’m sure a *lot* of instruments and amplifiers have been sold in the >time Fender has existed and it could become a really big production if >they got into it which is probably why they don’t want to do it.

That’d be understandable, but in special situations, they should be able to handle it. And Fender probably already knows that this situation is being discussed here, and they’ll probably do nothing to clarify anything, or try to justify flicking the OP like a booger. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> But there are a lot of great pickup companies right now who rewind > pickups. Things actually couldn’t be better in that regard IMO. >I agree 100%. I’m sure Abigail Ybarra does a great job winding pickups >(she’s been doing it for long enough) and maybe there *is* something >she does that makes a better sounding pickup but my opinion is that the >whole thing is a marketing ploy by Fender. I’ve never tried a Ybarra >pickup let alone compared it to any others, but that’s the feeling I >get from the whole thing. >Here is a quote by Caesar Diaz from an old issue of ToneQuest Report: >* * * >When I was at the Fender Custom Shop, I asked Abigail Ybarra if the >winding machine was off in the counter. Her eyes got huge and she said, >"How do you know that?" I said, "Well, I’ve taken a lot of pickups >apart and I know that you wound them by turns, and I’ve seen >published figures that so many turns equalled so much resistance." >* * * >Source: >http://www.tonequest.com/pdf_pubs/samples/TQRDiaz.pdf >So, in light of that, it confirms what most of us assumed or knew >already in that older pickups haven’t been consistent over the years >anyway. This is no fault of Abigail Ybarra’s; she has to work with >equipment that is less than perfect. If she’s still using the same >machine, it’s a hit or miss proposition. Let’s say that Fender >retooled and got new winding machines and Ybarra is using those now – >are you going to get back a pickup that sounded the way it did in the >first place? Not likely; pickups may be more consistent from one to >the other now but you have to ask *which* pickup is it on which they >are now basing their standard. >Building pickups doesn’t involve mojo, it’s a science and guys like >Bill Lawrence and Jason Lollar have made it their entire career – and >not just by winding the coils. However, the guy who wants the pickup >wound by Ybarra does have a point in that the guitar will probably >retain better value simply because the pickup would be rewound by >*her.* A rewind or replacement by Lollar or one of the other guys >could be better than the Ybarra rewind in every aspect including the >way it sounds but that won’t matter because it’s the "mojo" that sells. > But, I’m not coming from the view of a collector so my entire point >may be moot anyway.

Ok, there might be some value to her doing the rewind, depending on the buyer, and depending on the person selling the guitar, and how well he can document things. But it’s too bad if the investment is more important than the instrument. I don’t look at it from a collector’s point of view either. I love some of the old guitars, but I’m more interested in the guitars themselves than the guys that’re using them for investments. Pete — That man was a successful encyclopaedia salesman. –Head of Careers Advisory Board

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> >> > > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of >> >> > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know >> >> > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy >> >> > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors >> >> > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract >> >> > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, >> >> > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why >> >> > people expect this level of service from Fender. >> >> Fender and GM are two different things. >> >> GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. >> >> GM does not RI their cars. >> >> GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. >> >> Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or >> >> Go ahead. Get some from them. >> >> But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. >> >Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not >> >the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on >> >a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a >> >thing when GM is not. >> Well, they probably *should* to maintain good relations with >> musicians. And this kind of thing tends to come to the public’s >> attention. >> Trouble is the OP talked to someone in a corporation who didn’t want >> anything that wasn’t part of daily routine to happen. If he had >> talked to someone else, things might have been different. >I think that Fender probably doesn’t want to get into it as they’re >probably not set up for servicing instruments on a large scale. I >think the question for them is where to draw the line. Okay, this >fellow has a really nice 1959 Stratocaster that needs a pickup rewound >and it would probably make for some nice PR piece if they did it and >Abigail Ybarra did the work. > Definitely. But you have to talk to the right person, who *knows* > that something like that could not only bring good publicity to the > company, but also make him look good for making it happen. > And sometimes you have to know how to talk to people to get their > cooperation. >But what about the guy with a 1978 Strat? Should he be able to have his guitar serviced? > Not worth the effort IMO. If a pickup in a ‘78 Fender goes bad, you > replace it, probably with something that’s better. Use the same PU > cover. >A 1966 Strat? > Send the pickup to a rewinder. >A ‘94? > Replace it with an aftermarket PU.

I don’t think Fender can win; no matter where they draw the line, somebody is going to be pissed and go on a rant about how Fender has terrible service. If they do work for the guy with the ‘59 but not the ‘66 or ‘78 or ‘94, you’ll have three out of four people pissed for one reason or another; probably claiming that Fender only does high profile work for people with deep enough wallets to afford vintage guitars or that they whore themselves to collectors or some such thing. In the end, it’s probably best for them to just leave all the repairs to third party technicians.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >> >> > > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of > >> >> > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know > >> >> > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy > >> >> > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors > >> >> > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract > >> >> > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, > >> >> > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why > >> >> > people expect this level of service from Fender. > >> >> Fender and GM are two different things. > >> >> GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. > >> >> GM does not RI their cars. > >> >> GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. > >> >> Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or > >> >> Go ahead. Get some from them. > >> >> But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. > >> >Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not > >> >the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on > >> >a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a > >> >thing when GM is not. > >> Well, they probably *should* to maintain good relations with > >> musicians. And this kind of thing tends to come to the public’s > >> attention. > >> Trouble is the OP talked to someone in a corporation who didn’t want > >> anything that wasn’t part of daily routine to happen. If he had > >> talked to someone else, things might have been different. > >I think that Fender probably doesn’t want to get into it as they’re > >probably not set up for servicing instruments on a large scale. I > >think the question for them is where to draw the line. Okay, this > >fellow has a really nice 1959 Stratocaster that needs a pickup rewound > >and it would probably make for some nice PR piece if they did it and > >Abigail Ybarra did the work. > Definitely. But you have to talk to the right person, who *knows* > that something like that could not only bring good publicity to the > company, but also make him look good for making it happen. > And sometimes you have to know how to talk to people to get their > cooperation. > >But what about the guy with a 1978 Strat? Should he be able to have his guitar serviced? > Not worth the effort IMO. If a pickup in a ‘78 Fender goes bad, you > replace it, probably with something that’s better. Use the same PU > cover. > >A 1966 Strat? > Send the pickup to a rewinder. > >A ‘94? > Replace it with an aftermarket PU. >I don’t think Fender can win; no matter where they draw the line, >somebody is going to be pissed and go on a rant about how Fender has >terrible service. If they do work for the guy with the ‘59 but not the >’66 or ‘78 or ‘94, you’ll have three out of four people pissed for one >reason or another; probably claiming that Fender only does high profile >work for people with deep enough wallets to afford vintage guitars or >that they whore themselves to collectors or some such thing. In the >end, it’s probably best for them to just leave all the repairs to third >party technicians.

Well, that’s what I’d like to happen actually. I’d rather see the guitar being handled by someone *better* than Fender. Has Fender ever done anything that would lead people to think that they know anything about restoring old guitars? Pete — That man was a successful encyclopaedia salesman. –Head of Careers Advisory Board

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> >> >> > > Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of >> >> >> > Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know >> >> >> > much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy >> >> >> > and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors >> >> >> > would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract >> >> >> > job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, >> >> >> > but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why >> >> >> > people expect this level of service from Fender. >> >> >> Fender and GM are two different things. >> >> >> GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. >> >> >> GM does not RI their cars. >> >> >> GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. >> >> >> Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or >> >> >> Go ahead. Get some from them. >> >> >> But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. >> >> >Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not >> >> >the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on >> >> >a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a >> >> >thing when GM is not. >> >> Well, they probably *should* to maintain good relations with >> >> musicians. And this kind of thing tends to come to the public’s >> >> attention. >> >> Trouble is the OP talked to someone in a corporation who didn’t want >> >> anything that wasn’t part of daily routine to happen. If he had >> >> talked to someone else, things might have been different. >> >I think that Fender probably doesn’t want to get into it as they’re >> >probably not set up for servicing instruments on a large scale. I >> >think the question for them is where to draw the line. Okay, this >> >fellow has a really nice 1959 Stratocaster that needs a pickup rewound >> >and it would probably make for some nice PR piece if they did it and >> >Abigail Ybarra did the work. >> Definitely. But you have to talk to the right person, who *knows* >> that something like that could not only bring good publicity to the >> company, but also make him look good for making it happen. >> And sometimes you have to know how to talk to people to get their >> cooperation. >> >But what about the guy with a 1978 Strat? Should he be able to have his guitar serviced? >> Not worth the effort IMO. If a pickup in a ‘78 Fender goes bad, you >> replace it, probably with something that’s better. Use the same PU >> cover. >> >A 1966 Strat? >> Send the pickup to a rewinder. >> >A ‘94? >> Replace it with an aftermarket PU. >I don’t think Fender can win; no matter where they draw the line, >somebody is going to be pissed and go on a rant about how Fender has >terrible service. If they do work for the guy with the ‘59 but not the >’66 or ‘78 or ‘94, you’ll have three out of four people pissed for one >reason or another; probably claiming that Fender only does high profile >work for people with deep enough wallets to afford vintage guitars or >that they whore themselves to collectors or some such thing. In the >end, it’s probably best for them to just leave all the repairs to third >party technicians. > Well, that’s what I’d like to happen actually. I’d rather see the > guitar being handled by someone *better* than Fender.

Same here. Not that I don’t think that Fender can’t do a good job, but I have a lot more confidence in a guy like Rich Koerner who lives and breathes this stuff, works on all sorts of different products and has probably seen it all rather than someone who works for the manufacturer and has to follow company guidelines instead of being able to work "outside the box." Plus, with someone local, you can take your guitar to them and probably have it back in around two weeks whereas dealing with Fender or another manufacturer, you have to pack up the instrument and pay for shipping while figuring in at least an extra week or two just for time to ship. > Has Fender ever done anything that would lead people to think that > they know anything about restoring old guitars?

Not to my knowledge. Certainly, they probably have lots of old schematics and measurements and such, but a third party technician who’s worked on a lot of guitars will have his own book of notes that reflect real world experience. We all know that Fender guitars have varied wildly and original specs aren’t going to take that into account but experience will.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>>Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of >>>Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know >>>much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy >>>and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors >>>would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract >>>job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, >>>but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why >>>people expect this level of service from Fender. >>Fender and GM are two different things. >>GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. >>GM does not RI their cars. >>GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. >>Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or >>Go ahead. Get some from them. >>But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. >Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not >the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on >a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a >thing when GM is not. > Well, they probably *should* to maintain good relations with > musicians. And this kind of thing tends to come to the public’s > attention. > Trouble is the OP talked to someone in a corporation who didn’t want > anything that wasn’t part of daily routine to happen. If he had > talked to someone else, things might have been different. > But there are a lot of great pickup companies right now who rewind > pickups. Things actually couldn’t be better in that regard IMO. > Pete > — > That man was a successful encyclopaedia salesman. > –Head of Careers Advisory Board

I don’t know… … has someone actually mentioned the SOLUTION to this dilemma…???? Send the stupid guitar/pickup to Rich K…. let him work his magic… and it’ll be good (or better) than new (er, I mean vintage). All the whining and moaning about Fender and their shitty business practices… FORGET THEM..! ! ! Move on..! ! ! They’re *history*..! ! ! They’ve been ‘crappin up’ for a LONG time now… it WON’T get any better. If anyone wants to spend TOP dollar for a bolt-on neck (made on a CNC router by some non-Fender contractor), "fender parts guitar" that is absolutely no better than any OTHER ‘parts guitar’… let them spend the money..! ! ! They will THINK that they have a superior product, and that is ok… really. Fender is TOO big and too ‘focused’ on earnings to deal with collectors, gigging musicians, old guys with old guitars, young guys with old guitars, and keeping the faith. Now, vintage gear, older gear, is all left to the smaller companies, techs, and players to maintain and enjoy. I was listening to some CDs the other day… bands I’d never heard of.. the stuff sounded GREAT..! ! Who freakin CARES what equipment Like Rich hollers over and over and over…. It’s about the freakin MUSIC folks..! ! ! Get your $4800 custom arch-top or your $125 Squire, plug in, and make some nice sounds. If you can’t get good tone, it’s 98% in your ability (or lack there-of) of tweakin the knobs… or pick/strum/pluck/lick/slap the strings… Remember the quote… ".. all ya gotta do is variate the knobs.." It’s right there on the AGA website. Read it and get playin..! ! !

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>>>>>Just as Fender has turned its back on it’s legacy, so Gibson follows, with this LACK of >>>>>>Rich, you’re in the business of repairing guitars and amps so you know >>>>>>much better than I do, but if you had a really nice vintage 57 Chevy >>>>>>and the engine needed to be rebuilt, do you think that General Motors >>>>>>would be willing to take your car and do the work for you as a contract >>>>>>job? Not likely. I’m sure they’d be willing to sell you some parts, >>>>>>but that’d be about the extent of it. I just don’t understand why >>>>>>people expect this level of service from Fender. >>>>>Fender and GM are two different things. >>>>>GM does not cut off their Dealer’s Service from parts and supplies. >>>>>GM does not RI their cars. >>>>>GM will sell you anything in current production to their dealers. >>>>>Try to get a truss rod from either Fender or Gibson to repair any of their necks. NEW, or >>>>>Go ahead. Get some from them. >>>>>But, you can get a T shirt, zippo lighter, or coffee mug, with their name on it. >>>>Those things may be true (you know better than I do), but that’s not >>>>the point. We were talking about having Fender perform repair work on >>>>a 40+ year old guitar and why they should be expected to do such a >>>>thing when GM is not. >>>Well, they probably *should* to maintain good relations with >>>musicians. And this kind of thing tends to come to the public’s >>>attention. >>>Trouble is the OP talked to someone in a corporation who didn’t want >>>anything that wasn’t part of daily routine to happen. If he had >>>talked to someone else, things might have been different. >>I think that Fender probably doesn’t want to get into it as they’re >>probably not set up for servicing instruments on a large scale. I >>think the question for them is where to draw the line. Okay, this >>fellow has a really nice 1959 Stratocaster that needs a pickup rewound >>and it would probably make for some nice PR piece if they did it and >>Abigail Ybarra did the work. >Definitely. But you have to talk to the right person, who *knows* >that something like that could not only bring good publicity to the >company, but also make him look good for making it happen. >And sometimes you have to know how to talk to people to get their >cooperation. >>But what about the guy with a 1978 Strat? Should he be able to have his guitar serviced? >Not worth the effort IMO. If a pickup in a ‘78 Fender goes bad, you >replace it, probably with something that’s better. Use the same PU >cover. >>A 1966 Strat? >Send the pickup to a rewinder. >>A ‘94? >Replace it with an aftermarket PU. > I don’t think Fender can win; no matter where they draw the line, > somebody is going to be pissed and go on a rant about how Fender has > terrible service. If they do work for the guy with the ‘59 but not the > ‘66 or ‘78 or ‘94, you’ll have three out of four people pissed for one > reason or another; probably claiming that Fender only does high profile > work for people with deep enough wallets to afford vintage guitars or > that they whore themselves to collectors or some such thing. In the > end, it’s probably best for them to just leave all the repairs to third > party technicians.

PING RICH K…! ! ! ! Here’s an unsolicited referral to all vintage Fender owners… RICH KOERNER - TIME ELECTRONICS Rich is a ‘Vintage Fender Repair Tech’ he himself, the person, is ‘vintage’… just like all the old equipment. He *sounds* good, like vintage gear should, he has all the *tone* that vintage gear should, he has ‘quality’ like *some* of the old gear has, and he’ll pick up the phone himself. Rich was an *authorized* Fender Repair Facility for so long that he is probably older than most of the people working for Fender now. Thus he has MORE experience with Fender products than the people at FENDER have. The people at Fender probably have to do research in their OWN archives to find info that Rich has in his head… I’ve had work done by Rich, he’s as good as they come. I’ve jammed on stage with Rich K., he can hang with the best… he plays guitar and bass and repairs most anything you can bring him. End of advert for Rich K. These opinions are mine and your mileage may vary…

Response:

As much as you would like to think Fender is like a mom & pop shop where Leo greets you at the door, gives you a glass of Cherry coke and a tour of his little work shop. It’s not. Anymore. It is a modern day business. .

Response:

Latest Mulay socks update

admin — Mon, 27 Mar 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Latest Mulay socks in just last 2 months: Joe-Ker iFC Henry Rollins I Expose jerkoffs, –jerkoff Herr Doktor Von Throbulator Ass Cheeks Sucking Your Face Any Major Dude El Throbulator U Respond = UR_A Stalker Your Rx Roccaforte’s Rx Sunlight Stalked By Dimwitted 59 Bassman R.I. 5F6-A Torch the Torso The Torso: Pit Bull Toy Stuff A ManGina Take it Like a ManGina, -bitch Take it Like a ManGina ManGina Abuser Ibecile Magnet! Doug R’s Idol Guitar Playing Here Mister Tiki Veni,Vidi,Vici Magnet for Neg. Whiners Maj. 9 Miracle Marcenoma The Iconoclast Sprint-hop’n_DICKdoublecheekslapface! Neocon Nerve GAS Weapon of Ass Destruction Parallel_Multiverse -U_pillowslobber Parallel_Multiverse ‘00 Carvin SM162 ‘78 Ovation A/E ‘85 Fender Strat MIJ ‘62 replica ‘91 Gibson Les Paul Custom ‘91 Alesis Quadraverb ‘05 RC Booster xotic effects usa ‘03 Presonus BlueMax ‘99 Zoom GFX-8 ‘05 Radial Tonebone Classic ‘99 Fender Bassman 5F6A ‘85 MIJ ‘62 Strat ‘86 ES-335 BackSeatfuk/EarlyStab’nShlorp Early Fetus Stab’nSuck I shot E-VEAL Sherrif & Deputies I shot Sherrif & Deputy I shot Sherrif & Deputies Remember -but forgive Thermvomitor Chief Slap-A-Ho 0200 Hrs. Oyster Bay, L.I. (516) 922-9463 Altruisim is Godmulay Love & Kindness Stiff Johnson Fak Dover Mr. Sir2U Music Test Tickles Blues Rock Distortion O+ A+ Alpha Centurion The Milky Way + Amptitude Ampitude Mr. Murka Anti White Trash de CAPitator AMp U! Tator 5F6A & MM2275-150 Tonsil tickler Moonbat Mary Stay informed and stay Mulay-free!

Response:

> Latest Mulay socks in just last 2 months: > Stay informed and stay Mulay-free!

Thanks! BTW, the Mulay sock list is much too short.

Response:

What if we are "all" socks. Twilight Zone!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Latest Mulay socks in just last 2 months: > Joe-Ker > iFC Henry Rollins > I Expose jerkoffs, –jerkoff > Herr Doktor Von Throbulator > Ass Cheeks Sucking Your Face > Any Major Dude > El Throbulator > U Respond = UR_A Stalker > Your Rx > Roccaforte’s Rx > Sunlight > Stalked By Dimwitted > 59 Bassman R.I. 5F6-A > Torch the Torso > The Torso: Pit Bull Toy > Stuff A ManGina > Take it Like a ManGina, -bitch > Take it Like a ManGina > ManGina Abuser > Ibecile Magnet! > Doug R’s Idol > Guitar Playing Here > Mister Tiki > Veni,Vidi,Vici > Magnet for Neg. Whiners > Maj. 9 > Miracle Marcenoma > The Iconoclast > Sprint-hop’n_DICKdoublecheekslapface! > Neocon Nerve GAS > Weapon of Ass Destruction > Parallel_Multiverse -U_pillowslobber > Parallel_Multiverse > ‘00 Carvin SM162 > ‘78 Ovation A/E > ‘85 Fender Strat MIJ ‘62 replica > ‘91 Gibson Les Paul Custom > ‘91 Alesis Quadraverb > ‘05 RC Booster xotic effects usa > ‘03 Presonus BlueMax > ‘99 Zoom GFX-8 > ‘05 Radial Tonebone Classic > ‘99 Fender Bassman 5F6A > ‘85 MIJ ‘62 Strat > ‘86 ES-335 > BackSeatfuk/EarlyStab’nShlorp > Early Fetus Stab’nSuck > I shot E-VEAL Sherrif & Deputies > I shot Sherrif & Deputy > I shot Sherrif & Deputies > Remember -but forgive > Thermvomitor > Chief Slap-A-Ho > 0200 Hrs. > Oyster Bay, L.I. > (516) 922-9463 > Altruisim is Godmulay > Love & Kindness > Stiff Johnson > Fak Dover > Mr. Sir2U > Music > Test Tickles > Blues Rock Distortion > O+ > A+ > Alpha Centurion > The Milky Way > + Amptitude > Ampitude > Mr. Murka > Anti White Trash > de CAPitator > AMp U! Tator > 5F6A & MM2275-150 > Tonsil tickler > Moonbat Mary > Stay informed and stay Mulay-free!

Response:

Bob Goldthwait and Freaked. http://a.videodetective.com/?PublishedID=452124

Response:

http://www.geocities.com/misheet/edthesock.wav

Response:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0312328052/ref=sib_fs_bod/104-8701720…

Response:

Ain’t gonna matter once I tell this NG how to filter you -er, umm.. him, lol. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >Latest Mulay socks in just last 2 months: >Joe-Ker >iFC Henry Rollins >I Expose jerkoffs, –jerkoff >Herr Doktor Von Throbulator >Ass Cheeks Sucking Your Face >Any Major Dude >El Throbulator >U Respond = UR_A Stalker >Your Rx >Roccaforte’s Rx >Sunlight >Stalked By Dimwitted >59 Bassman R.I. 5F6-A >Torch the Torso >The Torso: Pit Bull Toy >Stuff A ManGina >Take it Like a ManGina, -bitch >Take it Like a ManGina >ManGina Abuser >Ibecile Magnet! >Doug R’s Idol >Guitar Playing Here >Mister Tiki >Veni,Vidi,Vici >Magnet for Neg. Whiners >Maj. 9 >Miracle Marcenoma >The Iconoclast >Sprint-hop’n_DICKdoublecheekslapface! >Neocon Nerve GAS >Weapon of Ass Destruction >Parallel_Multiverse -U_pillowslobber >Parallel_Multiverse >’00 Carvin SM162 >’78 Ovation A/E >’85 Fender Strat MIJ ‘62 replica >’91 Gibson Les Paul Custom >’91 Alesis Quadraverb >’05 RC Booster xotic effects usa >’03 Presonus BlueMax >’99 Zoom GFX-8 >’05 Radial Tonebone Classic >’99 Fender Bassman 5F6A >’85 MIJ ‘62 Strat >’86 ES-335 >BackSeatfuk/EarlyStab’nShlorp >Early Fetus Stab’nSuck >I shot E-VEAL Sherrif & Deputies >I shot Sherrif & Deputy >I shot Sherrif & Deputies >Remember -but forgive >Thermvomitor >Chief Slap-A-Ho >0200 Hrs. >Oyster Bay, L.I. >(516) 922-9463 >Altruisim is Godmulay >Love & Kindness >Stiff Johnson >Fak Dover >Mr. Sir2U >Music >Test Tickles >Blues Rock Distortion >O+ >A+ >Alpha Centurion >The Milky Way >+ Amptitude >Ampitude >Mr. Murka >Anti White Trash >de CAPitator >AMp U! Tator >5F6A & MM2275-150 >Tonsil tickler >Moonbat Mary >Stay informed and stay Mulay-free!

Response:

lemme beat you to the punch Everybody here’ how to filter: http://www.modezero.com/phase-filter.htm whoops not that one, THIS one! http://totallyabsurd.com/cheesefiltercigarette.htm cheesefiltered! It’s got you name written all over it!!!

Response:

and you can too!! http://estore.websitepros.com/771419/StoreFront.bok http://www.renfro.com/consumer/Renfro/funstuff/sockcalculator/

Response:

General questions about bridging channels with a patch cord

admin — Mon, 27 Mar 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Channel bridging: what is it? How is it done? What are the risks? What are the results? etc. I have a Fender Twin ‘65 reissue that is pretty new. Don’t know how to bridge channels or if I should or if I can even. I also have been able to find very little information on this topic on the internet but I know that some people do (stupid?) stuff like this. I have been playing guitar a good long while but I am not a gear head, and I keep my amp setup quite simple. This question is really for my brother inlaw who has also been playing a good long while now, but is much more of a gear head, and wants to know what else he can do with his non-channel switching Twin ‘65 reissue. Thanks! — | http://www.newtnotes.com DJMBS | http://newtnotes.com/doctor-jeff-master-brainsurgeon/

Response:

> Channel bridging: > what is it?

Running both input channels in parallel. > How is it done?

Generally, it means taking a short patch cord between the unused input on one channel and running it to the other channel. > What are the risks?

If the above is all you do, little risk. Perhaps with some amps, you can get a little more chance of squeals and other unwanted oscillations if you run the volumes up. > What are the results?

In amps where this works, a little more gain and generally "different" tone. Hard to describe, you’ll have to hear it for yourself. On your amp (and other Fenders with tube-driven reverb), you’ll be disappointed by the results. Your two channels are out off phase with each other by the time the signal reaches the power amp section. You’ll see some cancellation when they’re mixed. Candidates for this technique: 4-input tweed Fender Bassman, Non-reverb Blackface and Silverface fenders, Marshall JTM45 and other 4-input Marshalls. > etc. > I have a Fender Twin ‘65 reissue that is pretty new. Don’t know how to > bridge channels or if I should or if I can even. I also have been able to > find very little information on this topic on the internet but I know that > some people do (stupid?) stuff like this. > I have been playing guitar a good long while but I am not a gear head, and > I keep my amp setup quite simple. This question is really for my brother > inlaw who has also been playing a good long while now, but is much more of > a gear head, and wants to know what else he can do with his non-channel > switching Twin ‘65 reissue.

With a Twin, you get what you get: a REALLY loud clean amp with solid bottom and sparkling highs. If you turn it up to where it overdrives, you’ll go deaf in no time (seriously). If you want "grind" out of a Twin, use a distortion pedal. > Thanks!

Mike Schway | [Picture your favorite quote here]

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Channel bridging: >what is it? > Running both input channels in parallel. >How is it done? > Generally, it means taking a short patch cord between the unused input > on one channel and running it to the other channel. >What are the risks? > If the above is all you do, little risk. Perhaps with some amps, you > can get a little more chance of squeals and other unwanted oscillations > if you run the volumes up. >What are the results? > In amps where this works, a little more gain and generally "different" > tone. Hard to describe, you’ll have to hear it for yourself. > On your amp (and other Fenders with tube-driven reverb), you’ll be > disappointed by the results. Your two channels are out off phase with > each other by the time the signal reaches the power amp section. You’ll > see some cancellation when they’re mixed. > Candidates for this technique: 4-input tweed Fender Bassman, Non-reverb > Blackface and Silverface fenders, Marshall JTM45 and other 4-input > Marshalls. >etc. >I have a Fender Twin ‘65 reissue that is pretty new. Don’t know how to >bridge channels or if I should or if I can even. I also have been able to >find very little information on this topic on the internet but I know that >some people do (stupid?) stuff like this. >I have been playing guitar a good long while but I am not a gear head, and >I keep my amp setup quite simple. This question is really for my brother >inlaw who has also been playing a good long while now, but is much more of >a gear head, and wants to know what else he can do with his non-channel >switching Twin ‘65 reissue. > With a Twin, you get what you get: a REALLY loud clean amp with solid > bottom and sparkling highs. If you turn it up to where it overdrives, > you’ll go deaf in no time (seriously). If you want "grind" out of a > Twin, use a distortion pedal. >Thanks! > Mike Schway | [Picture your favorite quote here]

Excellent post. mvm

Response:

> Channel bridging: > what is it? > How is it done? > What are the risks? > What are the results?

Bridging is done by running the inputs of two identical amplifier channels (ie a stereo amp) with the opposite polarity ("out of phase") and placing the load on the positive terminals of the outputs. The load must remain balanced or ungrounded. The result is double the power output into a single load as compared to the individual channels. > I have a Fender Twin ‘65 reissue that is pretty new. Don’t know how to > bridge channels or if I should or if I can even. I also have been able to > find very little information on this topic on the internet but I know that > some people do (stupid?) stuff like this.

You can’t "bridge" a mono amp. > I have been playing guitar a good long while but I am not a gear head, and > I keep my amp setup quite simple. This question is really for my brother > inlaw who has also been playing a good long while now, but is much more of > a gear head, and wants to know what else he can do with his non-channel > switching Twin ‘65 reissue.

You can run a patch cord from one channel input to the other and MIX the signals in the amp, but in a Twin or other Fender amp with dissimilar channels I believe the signals are of opposite polarity and will cancel to some degree. This is sometimes refered to as "out-of-phase" but this is another incorrect use of terminology. rd

Response:

> Candidates for this technique: 4-input tweed Fender Bassman, Non-reverb > Blackface and Silverface fenders, Marshall JTM45 and other 4-input > Marshalls.

So it makes no sense with (tube) amps with one "low" and one "high" input but these inputs don’t have separate pre-amps (I wouldn’t call it stereo)?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>Channel bridging: >>what is it? > Running both input channels in parallel. >>How is it done? > Generally, it means taking a short patch cord between the unused input > on one channel and running it to the other channel. >>What are the risks? > If the above is all you do, little risk. Perhaps with some amps, you > can get a little more chance of squeals and other unwanted oscillations > if you run the volumes up. >>What are the results? > In amps where this works, a little more gain and generally "different" > tone. Hard to describe, you’ll have to hear it for yourself. > On your amp (and other Fenders with tube-driven reverb), you’ll be > disappointed by the results. Your two channels are out off phase with > each other by the time the signal reaches the power amp section. You’ll > see some cancellation when they’re mixed. > Candidates for this technique: 4-input tweed Fender Bassman, Non-reverb > Blackface and Silverface fenders, Marshall JTM45 and other 4-input > Marshalls. >>etc. >>I have a Fender Twin ‘65 reissue that is pretty new. Don’t know how to >>bridge channels or if I should or if I can even. I also have been able to >>find very little information on this topic on the internet but I know that >>some people do (stupid?) stuff like this. >>I have been playing guitar a good long while but I am not a gear head, and >>I keep my amp setup quite simple. This question is really for my brother >>inlaw who has also been playing a good long while now, but is much more of >>a gear head, and wants to know what else he can do with his non-channel >>switching Twin ‘65 reissue. > With a Twin, you get what you get: a REALLY loud clean amp with solid > bottom and sparkling highs. If you turn it up to where it overdrives, > you’ll go deaf in no time (seriously). If you want "grind" out of a > Twin, use a distortion pedal. >>Thanks! > Mike Schway | [Picture your favorite quote here] >Excellent post. mvm

I had a 67 SF back in ‘67 and would take a ‘Y’ cord and put my Maestro fuzz box on one channel and run clean to the other channel. When you hit the dip (out of phase) level, it produced this beautiful creamy distortion. Sounded great. Of course, like you said, a loss of volume was noticeable. It really tamed that Maestro. Great distortion at bedroom levels. Really not worth anything. Just my experience. Wayne

Response:

> With a Twin, you get what you get: a REALLY loud clean amp with solid > bottom and sparkling highs. If you turn it up to where it overdrives, > you’ll go deaf in no time (seriously). If you want "grind" out of a > Twin, use a distortion pedal.

Perfect. Thanks. Just the sort of information I was looking for, simply stated, sufficiently specific, yet succintly summarized. later, hoss… — | http://www.newtnotes.com DJMBS | http://newtnotes.com/doctor-jeff-master-brainsurgeon/

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Channel bridging: >what is it? >How is it done? >What are the risks? >What are the results? > Bridging is done by running the inputs of two identical > amplifier channels (ie a stereo amp) with the opposite > polarity ("out of phase") and placing the load on the > positive terminals of the outputs. The load must remain > balanced or ungrounded. The result is double the power > output into a single load as compared to the individual > channels. >I have a Fender Twin ‘65 reissue that is pretty new. Don’t know how to >bridge channels or if I should or if I can even. I also have been able to >find very little information on this topic on the internet but I know that >some people do (stupid?) stuff like this. > You can’t "bridge" a mono amp. >I have been playing guitar a good long while but I am not a gear head, and >I keep my amp setup quite simple. This question is really for my brother >inlaw who has also been playing a good long while now, but is much more of >a gear head, and wants to know what else he can do with his non-channel >switching Twin ‘65 reissue. > You can run a patch cord from one channel input to the > other and MIX the signals in the amp, but in a Twin or > other Fender amp with dissimilar channels I believe the > signals are of opposite polarity and will cancel to some > degree. This is sometimes refered to as "out-of-phase" > but this is another incorrect use of terminology.

Curious… Why is "out of phase" incorrect terminology? Isn’t opposite polarity (with an AC signal) the same as 180 degrees out of phase?

Response:

>> You can run a patch cord from one channel input to the > other and MIX the signals in the amp, but in a Twin or > other Fender amp with dissimilar channels I believe the > signals are of opposite polarity and will cancel to some > degree. This is sometimes refered to as "out-of-phase" > but this is another incorrect use of terminology. >Curious… Why is "out of phase" incorrect terminology? Isn’t opposite >polarity (with an AC signal) the same as 180 degrees out of phase?

Yes. -DC

Response:

If you want to experiment, put a pedal in the patch cord.

Response:

>> Candidates for this technique: 4-input tweed Fender Bassman, > Non-reverb Blackface and Silverface fenders, Marshall JTM45 and other > 4-input Marshalls. > So it makes no sense with (tube) amps with one "low" and one "high" > input but these inputs don’t have separate pre-amps (I wouldn’t call > it stereo)?

Ohhhhh it makes lots of sense. On my old Bassman I can plug my Strat into the low input and play with clean headroom all night long. Put the same guitar in the high input and its screaming distortion. Strats sound much better in a Bassman than in a Marshall, in my opinion. Jumper the bass and normal channels together and you get some interesting tone variations.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> Candidates for this technique: 4-input tweed Fender Bassman, >> Non-reverb Blackface and Silverface fenders, Marshall JTM45 and other >> 4-input Marshalls. > So it makes no sense with (tube) amps with one "low" and one "high" > input but these inputs don’t have separate pre-amps (I wouldn’t call > it stereo)? > Strats sound > much better in a Bassman than in a Marshall, in my opinion. Jumper the > bass and normal channels together and you get some interesting tone > variations.

I’ll try it this evening (with my Marshall). I’d really love to play my Strat over a Bassman, but none I know has one. I prefer a Marshall but the best would be Marshall PLUS Bassman, but the ugly word beginng with "M" and ending with "oney", you know….

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>> Candidates for this technique: 4-input tweed Fender Bassman, >>> Non-reverb Blackface and Silverface fenders, Marshall JTM45 and >>> other 4-input Marshalls. >> So it makes no sense with (tube) amps with one "low" and one "high" >> input but these inputs don’t have separate pre-amps (I wouldn’t call >> it stereo)? > Strats sound much better in a Bassman than in a Marshall, in my > opinion. Jumper the bass and normal channels together and you get some > interesting tone variations. > I’ll try it this evening (with my Marshall). > I’d really love to play my Strat over a Bassman, but none I know has > one. > I prefer a Marshall but the best would be Marshall PLUS Bassman, but > the ugly word beginng with "M" and ending with "oney", you know….

Single coils in the bright channel of my Super Lead sound nasal. Running a jumper from the low side of the bright channel to the high side if the normal channel allow me to fatten up the sound with more mids and lows. The Bassman’s tone stack on the bass channel already does that for me. I’ve got my normal channel tweaked to give me that classic fender sound clean through the low input, and dirty through the high input. Sort of the best of both worlds.

Response:

> Single plate in the dim channel of my head feels nasal.

DROP THE AMP

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>You can run a patch cord from one channel input to the >>other and MIX the signals in the amp, but in a Twin or >>other Fender amp with dissimilar channels I believe the >>signals are of opposite polarity and will cancel to some >>degree. This is sometimes refered to as "out-of-phase" >>but this is another incorrect use of terminology. >Curious… Why is "out of phase" incorrect terminology? Isn’t opposite >polarity (with an AC signal) the same as 180 degrees out of phase? > Yes. > -DC

It was rhetorical, but got no response from the poster.

Response:

>> Single plate in the dim channel of my head feels nasal. > DROP > THE > AMP

Response:

>>> Single plate in the dim channel of my head feels nasal. > DROP > THE > AMP

Response:

Work in progress

admin — Thu, 23 Mar 2006 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Hello, I tried something else entirely, having done mostly heavy metal these days, a bluesy song. Also ditched the drum machines. This is very much work in progress, it needs vox also, and I haven’t figured out what they should be like. The drums are a real cheap hi-hat and as a snare I’m using my kid’s plastic toy drum. I’m not a drummer as you can hear so maybe I’ll replace the drums later on. The leads are played by my old band’s bassists actually, I like his style of playing guitar a lot. He played ‘em in with clean sounds, singlecoil Strat he built for himself from scratch. Though, he’ll be amazed when I play this to him, having tweaked it into distortion after the fact LOL. In fact the bass too is played by another friend, who’s a professional player, so my part so far has been really composing and laying down the drums and backing guitars. Any comments on what should I add or not add anymore? I’m thinking either vox or playing the vox melody over this with a guitar to make it an instrumental. Maybe I can get someone with a raspy blues voice to collaborate on this one, if I find it too hard to sing as I’m more like a heavy/whatever singer. http://www.kuas.net/SaveU.mp3

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hello, > I tried something else entirely, having done mostly heavy metal these days, > a bluesy song. > Also ditched the drum machines. This is very much work in progress, it needs > vox also, and I haven’t figured out what they should be like. > The drums are a real cheap hi-hat and as a snare I’m using my kid’s plastic > toy drum. I’m not a drummer as you can hear so maybe I’ll replace the drums > later on. > The leads are played by my old band’s bassists actually, I like his style of > playing guitar a lot. He played ‘em in with clean sounds, singlecoil Strat > he built for himself from scratch. Though, he’ll be amazed when I play this > to him, having tweaked it into distortion after the fact LOL. In fact > the bass too is played by another friend, who’s a professional player, so my > part so far has been really composing and laying down the drums and backing > guitars. > Any comments on what should I add or not add anymore? I’m thinking either > vox or playing the vox melody over this with a guitar to make it an > instrumental. > Maybe I can get someone with a raspy blues voice to collaborate on this one, > if I find it too hard to sing as I’m more like a heavy/whatever singer. > http://www.kuas.net/SaveU.mp3

Not half bad! The recording quality is remarkably good for a home effort. Or do you have a studio? ;) I see what you mean about the drums. You’re not a terrible drummer, but you do get behind the beat a little on occasion, and a song of this tempo requires an effortless drum feel. A good drummer would really help the strength of the song. The drums are mixed and recorded very well, though. I’m with you–a raspy blues voice would be great for this number. Maybe Stevie Ray…too bad he’s not available. But try to find a good substitute. It’ll be worth it. Otherwise, this might make a good track for a movie as an instrumental. –E

Response:

> Not half bad! The recording quality is remarkably good for a home > effort. Or do you have a studio? ;)

Well, I have a computer with Cubase and a DBX tube channel strip/ A/D converter with eq and compressor and all, and a nice rode mic, some synamic shures, plus an assortment of guitar gear. It’s enough for nice home tracks but sometimes difficult when it comes to adjusting your own vox sounds for instance.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Hello, > I tried something else entirely, having done mostly heavy metal these days, > a bluesy song. > Also ditched the drum machines. This is very much work in progress, it needs > vox also, and I haven’t figured out what they should be like. > The drums are a real cheap hi-hat and as a snare I’m using my kid’s plastic > toy drum. I’m not a drummer as you can hear so maybe I’ll replace the drums > later on. > The leads are played by my old band’s bassists actually, I like his style of > playing guitar a lot. He played ‘em in with clean sounds, singlecoil Strat > he built for himself from scratch. Though, he’ll be amazed when I play this > to him, having tweaked it into distortion after the fact LOL. In fact > the bass too is played by another friend, who’s a professional player, so my > part so far has been really composing and laying down the drums and backing > guitars. > Any comments on what should I add or not add anymore? I’m thinking either > vox or playing the vox melody over this with a guitar to make it an > instrumental. > Maybe I can get someone with a raspy blues voice to collaborate on this one, > if I find it too hard to sing as I’m more like a heavy/whatever singer. > http://www.kuas.net/SaveU.mp3

As far as alt.guitar.amps goes, you’ll find only wannabe’s who literally don’t know how to play and leach in for purely political posts and the cyberstalkers among them who can’t stomach the afformentioned honest spotlight and ‘flame war perpeuate’ as a hoped-for winning reaction. You’re ***** better off posting in pen on some bulliten board at your most local Guitar Sales and Repair Shop. You’ll see. Good luck! mvm

Response:

Very nice DeeAa. I can hear some piano in there Bro. I know a female vocalist who has the sexiest and best voice you could imagine. I could probably get her to sing it for you. Do you already have lyrics? May I ask what key the song is being played in?

Hello, I tried something else entirely, having done mostly heavy metal these days, a bluesy song. Also ditched the drum machines. This is very much work in progress, it needs vox also, and I haven’t figured out what they should be like. The drums are a real cheap hi-hat and as a snare I’m using my kid’s plastic toy drum. I’m not a drummer as you can hear so maybe I’ll replace the drums later on. The leads are played by my old band’s bassists actually, I like his style of playing guitar a lot. He played ‘em in with clean sounds, singlecoil Strat he built for himself from scratch. Though, he’ll be amazed when I play this to him, having tweaked it into distortion after the fact LOL. In fact the bass too is played by another friend, who’s a professional player, so my part so far has been really composing and laying down the drums and backing guitars. Any comments on what should I add or not add anymore? I’m thinking either vox or playing the vox melody over this with a guitar to make it an instrumental. Maybe I can get someone with a raspy blues voice to collaborate on this one, if I find it too hard to sing as I’m more like a heavy/whatever singer. http://www.kuas.net/SaveU.mp3

Response:

Do you already have lyrics? May I ask what key the song is being played in?

Response:

> Do you already have lyrics? May I ask what key the song is being > played in?

Key? Listen and jam in. If you can’t, -learn how; That’s musical experience. Honestly, if /and/or when you ever get on stage with a bunch of guys you don’t know, -if you’re not familiar with the key (the song), it’ll take off before anyone’s told you. Is it it A? A minor? both? If blues, probably- in that situation… -otherwise, ye best develop a good ear! Learn the neck.

Response:

Listen any major dude.I was playing music when you still had your mouth latched on to your mammies tit. Wise ass motherfuc$er. > Do you already have lyrics? May I ask what key the song is being > played in?

Key? Listen and jam in. If you can’t, -learn how; That’s musical experience. Honestly, if /and/or when you ever get on stage with a bunch of guys you don’t know, -if you’re not familiar with the key (the song), it’ll take off before anyone’s told you. Is it it A? A minor? both? If blues, probably- in that situation… -otherwise, ye best develop a good ear! Learn the neck.

Response:

> Very nice DeeAa. I can hear some piano in there Bro. I know a female > vocalist who has the sexiest and best voice you could imagine. I could > probably get her to sing it for you. > Do you already have lyrics? May I ask what key the song is being > played in?

Well, that would sound real cool I have some lyrics, not very good I’m afraid, maybe they’d need work…don’t know if they make any sense…just wrote them quickly for the bluesy sad feel…here: A bottle’s not a key they say to Mend a broken heart The bottle is the way you like it Your highway bright, It’s got all the bends you would expect and some that you won’t see Until you’ve hit the curb and rolled in the ditch for awhile Ch. So we save you time and time again until the end And we save save save ourselves we need to make amends And all the children sing the tunes their fathers teach them yes they do We’re all a shipwreck on a shore of broken glass and shattered dreams The song is in C.

Response:

> Listen any major dude.I was playing music when you still had your > mouth latched on to your mammies tit. Wise ass motherfuc$er.

Kieth Babe? That argument’s an _ancient_bitch_! I imagine it used to work! I use to try it on everyone born after my b.d. 1957 -I learned: -they couldn’t possibly give a fat baby’s dick! . Hey! for the love you seek, contact DG(punk ass)Devin* or Claude V. Lucas (‘ol yeller) both w/in alt.guitar.effects for pals. till then, http://www.geocities.com/mvm55555/ Now grow old wisely like a man, -bitch *Devin often sockhifts out as; >> Tip Dover = >> Leon = >> ‘74 Ebow = >> Arthur Mandel = >> Hector Jiminez = >> Road Amp = >> Roger B = >> Ampwerks DE = >> Lab Rat = >> Swiss Cheddar = >> Boom Boom Mulai = >> Stroker Ace = >> Nick Byron = >> Mark Hern = >> George Horatio = >> Marshall = >> ‘67 Strat = >> Kelvin = >> Leo Gump 1 & 2= >> Johnny McWeed = >> Sammy Sousar = >> Ronald Mc Asswipe = >> Ned Blum = >> Carl Carlson = >> Doktor Freud = >> Furley = >> Kosmo Kramer = >> Lenny Leonard = >> Ralph K = >> Roper = >> Stanley Roper = >> Sgt. Hulka = If he fails to respond, check in with his mvm co-stalker Mary Stanley of Bear Feet Shoes in Brownsville, TX. She "feels sorry for him", –but if you’re nice to her, she’ll spill her guts about virtually anything. Good luck! mvm

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > The bottle’s not a key to mend a broken heart > The bottle is the way you like it -I drink then I fart! > It’s got all the bends I expected yet most I didn’t see > Until I hit the curb rolled into a ditch and began to pee > Ch. > So I saved time and time again until the end > And I save save saved myself to make amends > And the children sing tunes their fathers taught them > Please lube my rear end > I’m a shipwreck on a shore of broken glass and shattered dreams > Bo hoo Simon listen, > I’m not even a poet > Let alone a musician > The song would bomb even in A minor or Bb minor

Response:

Nice lyrics man. Sometimes they dont have to make allot of sense and abstract is best. It lets people form their own images and meanings. Why I asked about the key was I was blowing some harp to it and had a couple fit fairly well ( depending on the position I was playing in ) but I wanted to be sure. I can send a version with some harp if you’d like? You left plenty of room so I didnt step on the guitar players toes.

> Very nice DeeAa. I can hear some piano in there Bro. I know a female > vocalist who has the sexiest and best voice you could imagine. I could > probably get her to sing it for you. > Do you already have lyrics? May I ask what key the song is being > played in?

Well, that would sound real cool I have some lyrics, not very good I’m afraid, maybe they’d need work…don’t know if they make any sense…just wrote them quickly for the bluesy sad feel…here: A bottle’s not a key they say to Mend a broken heart The bottle is the way you like it Your highway bright, It’s got all the bends you would expect and some that you won’t see Until you’ve hit the curb and rolled in the ditch for awhile Ch. So we save you time and time again until the end And we save save save ourselves we need to make amends And all the children sing the tunes their fathers teach them yes they do We’re all a shipwreck on a shore of broken glass and shattered dreams The song is in C.

Response:

Hey DeeAa. You cant take anyone too seriously who goes by the name of any major dude.I’ll fuc% his dope up for him id I ever get the chance to.

Hello, I tried something else entirely, having done mostly heavy metal these days, a bluesy song. Also ditched the drum machines. This is very much work in progress, it needs vox also, and I haven’t figured out what they should be like. The drums are a real cheap hi-hat and as a snare I’m using my kid’s plastic toy drum. I’m not a drummer as you can hear so maybe I’ll replace the drums later on. The leads are played by my old band’s bassists actually, I like his style of playing guitar a lot. He played ‘em in with clean sounds, singlecoil Strat he built for himself from scratch. Though, he’ll be amazed when I play this to him, having tweaked it into distortion after the fact LOL. In fact the bass too is played by another friend, who’s a professional player, so my part so far has been really composing and laying down the drums and backing guitars. Any comments on what should I add or not add anymore? I’m thinking either vox or playing the vox melody over this with a guitar to make it an instrumental. Maybe I can get someone with a raspy blues voice to collaborate on this one, if I find it too hard to sing as I’m more like a heavy/whatever singer. http://www.kuas.net/SaveU.mp3

Response:

Where do you live at ? Answer up or keep your cowardly shit to yourself. > Listen any major dude.I was playing music when you still had your > mouth latched on to your mammies tit. Wise ass motherfuc$er.

Kieth Babe? That argument’s an _ancient_bitch_! I imagine it used to work! I use to try it on everyone born after my b.d. 1957 -I learned: -they couldn’t possibly give a fat baby’s dick! . Hey! for the love you seek, contact DG(punk ass)Devin* or Claude V. Lucas (‘ol yeller) both w/in alt.guitar.effects for pals. till then, http://www.geocities.com/mvm55555/ Now grow old wisely like a man, -bitch *Devin often sockhifts out as; >> Tip Dover = >> Leon = >> ‘74 Ebow = >> Arthur Mandel = >> Hector Jiminez = >> Road Amp = >> Roger B = >> Ampwerks DE = >> Lab Rat = >> Swiss Cheddar = >> Boom Boom Mulai = >> Stroker Ace = >> Nick Byron = >> Mark Hern = >> George Horatio = >> Marshall = >> ‘67 Strat = >> Kelvin = >> Leo Gump 1 & 2= >> Johnny McWeed = >> Sammy Sousar = >> Ronald Mc Asswipe = >> Ned Blum = >> Carl Carlson = >> Doktor Freud = >> Furley = >> Kosmo Kramer = >> Lenny Leonard = >> Ralph K = >> Roper = >> Stanley Roper = >> Sgt. Hulka = If he fails to respond, check in with his mvm co-stalker Mary Stanley of Bear Feet Shoes in Brownsville, TX. She "feels sorry for him", –but if you’re nice to her, she’ll spill her guts about virtually anything. Good luck! mvm

Response:

>> Listen any major dude.I was playing music when you still had your > mouth latched on to your mammies tit. Wise ass motherfuc$er. >Kieth Babe? That argument’s an _ancient_bitch_! I imagine it used to >work! I use to try it on everyone born after my b.d. 1957 -I learned: >-they couldn’t possibly give a fat baby’s dick! . Hey! for the love >you seek, contact DG(punk ass)Devin* or Claude V. Lucas (‘ol yeller) >both w/in alt.guitar.effects for pals. till then, >http://www.geocities.com/mvm55555/ >Now grow old wisely like a man, -bitch

So, Marc. Whose fault is it that you are a Sad, Pathetic Asshole? GW Bush’s?, LV’s?, DG’s?, Mine?, Your Mom’s? Do keep annoying the lurkers who post music that is actually listenable, though. Some may not yet be convinced of your S.P.A. status. BTW, Keith. Marc *still* has his mouth attached to his mammie’s tit. Problem is, he thinks AGA is his mammie. — | ^ JOIN THE | /" ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN | / TO RID USENET OF | X NATTERING FUCKWITS | /

Response:

> Nice lyrics man. Sometimes they dont have to make allot of sense and > abstract is best. It lets people form their own images and meanings. > Why I asked about the key was I was blowing some harp to it and had a > couple fit fairly well ( depending on the position I was playing in ) > but I wanted to be sure. I can send a version with some harp if you’d > like? You left plenty of room so I didnt step on the guitar players > toes.

Sure – can you do a track that has only the harp parts, so I could mix it in? It would work better, even if in mono if you can’t do a separate track. deeaa at dnainternet dot net is the address.

Response:

Thanks Claude. A pal clued me in to his antics . I aint going there no more. I only wish I’d never went in the first place. BCOOL whined: > Listen any major dude.I was playing music when you still had your > mouth latched on to your mammies tit. Wise ass motherfuc$er. >Kieth Babe? That argument’s an _ancient_bitch_! I imagine it used to >work! I use to try it on everyone born after my b.d. 1957 -I learned: >-they couldn’t possibly give a fat baby’s dick! . Hey! for the love >you seek, contact DG(punk ass)Devin* or Claude V. Lucas (‘ol yeller) >both w/in alt.guitar.effects for pals. till then, >http://www.geocities.com/mvm55555/ >Now grow old wisely like a man, -bitch

So, Marc. Whose fault is it that you are a Sad, Pathetic Asshole? GW Bush’s?, LV’s?, DG’s?, Mine?, Your Mom’s? Do keep annoying the lurkers who post music that is actually listenable, though. Some may not yet be convinced of your S.P.A. status. BTW, Keith. Marc *still* has his mouth attached to his mammie’s tit. Problem is, he thinks AGA is his mammie. — | ^ JOIN THE | /" ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN | / TO RID USENET OF | X NATTERING FUCKWITS | /

Response:

Hey DeeAa I can do it anyway you want it I reckon. What say I record something first to see if you even like the way it sounds and if harp is appropriate ? My best harp mic took a sick leave and I’m in the process of fixing it right now. I’ll send you something directly though.

> Nice lyrics man. Sometimes they dont have to make allot of sense and > abstract is best. It lets people form their own images and meanings. > Why I asked about the key was I was blowing some harp to it and had a > couple fit fairly well ( depending on the position I was playing in ) > but I wanted to be sure. I can send a version with some harp if you’d > like? You left plenty of room so I didnt step on the guitar players > toes.

Sure – can you do a track that has only the harp parts, so I could mix it in? It would work better, even if in mono if you can’t do a separate track. deeaa at dnainternet dot net is the address.

Response:

Were all a shipwreck on a shore of broken glass and shattered dreams Yes shattered dreams and nightmare screams Passing sailors stare For jagged rocks and unpicked locks Or signs that say beware

> Very nice DeeAa. I can hear some piano in there Bro. I know a female > vocalist who has the sexiest and best voice you could imagine. I could > probably get her to sing it for you. > Do you already have lyrics? May I ask what key the song is being > played in?

Well, that would sound real cool I have some lyrics, not very good I’m afraid, maybe they’d need work…don’t know if they make any sense…just wrote them quickly for the bluesy sad feel…here: A bottle’s not a key they say to Mend a broken heart The bottle is the way you like it Your highway bright, It’s got all the bends you would expect and some that you won’t see Until you’ve hit the curb and rolled in the ditch for awhile Ch. So we save you time and time again until the end And we save save save ourselves we need to make amends And all the children sing the tunes their fathers teach them yes they do We’re all a shipwreck on a shore of broken glass and shattered dreams The song is in C.

Response:

> Hey DeeAa I can do it anyway you want it I reckon. What say I record > something first to see if you even like the way it sounds and if harp > is appropriate ? My best harp mic took a sick leave and I’m in the > process of fixing it right now. I’ll send you something directly > though.

Sounds like a good idea!

Response:

> The song is in C.

Sounds like it’s in Gm to me. — Mark Davis San Angelo, TX

Response:

> Were all a shipwreck on a shore of broken glass and shattered dreams > Yes shattered dreams and nightmare screams > Passing sailors stare > For jagged rocks and unpicked locks > Or signs that say beware

That’s great, Keith! Can I use that for the song? Or lemme know if you can get someone to sing that! Came to think, that if need be, I suppose I could make the song a bit longer with some editing in Cubase….for more room for vox etc.

Response:

> As far as alt.guitar.amps goes, you’ll find only wannabe’s who > literally > don’t know how to play and leach in for purely political posts and > the cyberstalkers among them who can’t stomach the afformentioned > honest > spotlight and ‘flame war perpeuate’ as a hoped-for winning reaction.

Ahh…. the irony Marc!

Response:

>>As far as alt.guitar.amps goes, you’ll find only wannabe’s who >literally don’t know how to play and leach in for purely political posts and >the cyberstalkers among them who can’t stomach the afformentioned >honest spotlight and ‘flame war perpeuate’ as a hoped-for winning reaction. > Ahh…. the irony Marc!

Which of the above describes you?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Where do you live at ? Answer up or keep your cowardly shit to > yourself. > THE sockhifter; > >> Tip Dover = > >> Leon = > >> ‘74 Ebow = > >> Arthur Mandel = > >> Hector Jiminez = > >> Road Amp = > >> Roger B = > >> Ampwerks DE = > >> Lab Rat = > >> Swiss Cheddar = > >> Boom Boom Mulai = > >> Stroker Ace = > >> Nick Byron = > >> Mark Hern = > >> George Horatio = > >> Marshall = > >> ‘67 Strat = > >> Kelvin = > >> Leo Gump 1 & 2= > >> Johnny McWeed = > >> Sammy Sousar = > >> Ronald Mc Asswipe = > >> Ned Blum = > >> Carl Carlson = > >> Doktor Freud = > >> Furley = > >> Kosmo Kramer = > >> Lenny Leonard = > >> Ralph K = > >> Roper = > >> Stanley Roper = > >> Sgt. Hulka =

Where do I live ….at? How does one answer such a question? Why ‘fo you do me like dat? http://www.geocities.com/mvm55555/

Response:

Cathode Biasing a Bassman Amp

admin — Sat, 10 Dec 2005 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode operation. Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a recommendation I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the cathode ground and adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v bypass cap. The hum balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors are grounded. With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. Not good. I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont really know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow the amps breaker. west

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode >operation. > Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a recommendation >I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the cathode ground and >adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v bypass cap. The hum >balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors are grounded. > With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of >standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. >Not good. > I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to >the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. > The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of >each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. > Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know >that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont really >know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm >recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow the >amps breaker. > west

I think that my non UL 50watt SF Bassman is cathode biased with 680ohm 10watt resistors, without bypass caps now. This is Robert Braught’s explanation on checking how hot it’s biased http://groups.google.com/group/alt.guitar.amps/msg/2de4be2235cc2979 I was going to try to put it into words how to do that from memory, but I figure I’d better not. This is pasted in from an earlier post of mine in the thread "SACRILEGE! NOS Bullshit Debunked…" when I was still using 500ohm resistors: What I got off my meter anyhow, 424V at the plates, and 33.5mv across the 500ohm cathode resistor. So… 424-33.5 = 390.5 33.5/500 = .067 .067×390.5 = 26.16 " Pete — You call that limping? I can limp circles around you! –Yumi

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode > operation. > Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a recommendation > I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the cathode ground and > adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v bypass cap. The hum > balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors are grounded. > With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of > standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. > Not good. > I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to > the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. > The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of > each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. > Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know > that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont really > know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm > recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow the > amps breaker.

If it were me I would be tempted to just use the standard pentode connection (without the Williamson taps) for a cathode bias setup. 1000 ohm 10 watt with the bypass cap. My Aireon 2×6L6 is like this and it runs moderately hot but not too bad. Sounds real nice. rd

Response:

Out of interest, what is the general difference one will notice, besides easy powertube replacement, when converting a tube amp to cathode bias? Thanks in advance. grol

Response:

> Out of interest, what is the general difference one will notice, besides > easy powertube replacement, when converting a tube amp to cathode bias? > Thanks in advance. > grol

Great distortion early on. Its like the knob goes to 11. Or 13. At 30-40 watts. This amp now has a gain character similar to my old Super Lead, but with voicing like a fender amp. Way too much bass right now, but that will change. Before the mod, the breakup was grainy and cold. After, its smoother. I don’t think the sound is for everyone, bit I really like it. Think early ZZ Top. A Deluxe on steroids. This Bassman was one of the CBS master volume versions that I got cheap last summer. I’ve killed the resale on it, but I don’t care, it is getting sweeet sounding at nearly any volume. And I’m learning a lot in this process.

Response:

>I’ve killed the resale on it, but I don’t care,

CBS killed the resale value themselves when thier "engineers" started churning out crappy unstable amps.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode > operation. > Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a recommendation > I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the cathode ground and > adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v bypass cap. The hum > balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors are grounded. > With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of standby, > the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. Not good. > I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to the > cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. > The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of > each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. > Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know > that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont really > know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm > recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow the > amps breaker. > west

You’re supposed to run both cathodes through the resistor. jk

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode > operation. > Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a > recommendation I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the > cathode ground and adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v > bypass cap. The hum balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors > are grounded. > With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of > standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. > Not good. > I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to > the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. > The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of > each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. > Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know > that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont > really know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm > recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow > the amps breaker. > west > You’re supposed to run both cathodes through the resistor. > jk

You mean just one resistor for both tubes?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode >> operation. >> Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a >> recommendation I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the >> cathode ground and adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v >> bypass cap. The hum balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors >> are grounded. >> With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of >> standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. >> Not good. >> I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to >> the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. >> The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of >> each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. >> Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know >> that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont >> really know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm >> recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow >> the amps breaker. >> west > You’re supposed to run both cathodes through the resistor. > jk > You mean just one resistor for both tubes?

Fender cathode biased amps with both tube’s cathodes through one resistor. The schematics I was looking at were for 6V6 amps though. But the directions that Doug Roccaforte outlined involved running each cathode through a separate 500ohm 5watt resistor, and I forget what bypass caps. Doug wasn’t talking about an UL Bassman amp though. I don’t know what kind of difference that’ll make. Pete — You call that limping? I can limp circles around you! –Yumi

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>> Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode >>>operation. >>> Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a >>>recommendation I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the >>>cathode ground and adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v >>>bypass cap. The hum balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors >>>are grounded. >>> With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of >>>standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. >>>Not good. >>> I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to >>>the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. >>> The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of >>>each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. >>> Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know >>>that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont >>>really know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm >>>recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow >>>the amps breaker. >>> west >>You’re supposed to run both cathodes through the resistor. >>jk > You mean just one resistor for both tubes? > Fender cathode biased amps with both tube’s cathodes through one > resistor. The schematics I was looking at were for 6V6 amps though. > But the directions that Doug Roccaforte outlined involved running each > cathode through a separate 500ohm 5watt resistor, and I forget what > bypass caps. > Doug wasn’t talking about an UL Bassman amp though. I don’t know what > kind of difference that’ll make. > Pete > — > You call that limping? > I can limp circles around you! –Yumi

I’m running each cathode through a seperate resistor right now, with no bypass caps. JK threw me for a small loop. The amp is no longer UL. I modded it to triode a little while back, but kept the diode bridge and huge 220mfd caps. Didn’t feel like looking for a choke coil and tube rectifier.

Response:

> You’re supposed to run both cathodes through the resistor.

But this is why you really need a bypass cap. Otherwise you loose some gain. You can select a smaller value if you want to roll off a bit of the low end. rd

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>> Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode >>>>operation. >>>> Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a >>>>recommendation I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the >>>>cathode ground and adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v >>>>bypass cap. The hum balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors >>>>are grounded. >>>> With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of >>>>standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. >>>>Not good. >>>> I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to >>>>the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. >>>> The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of >>>>each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. >>>> Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know >>>>that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont >>>>really know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm >>>>recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow >>>>the amps breaker. >>>> west >>>You’re supposed to run both cathodes through the resistor. >>>jk >> You mean just one resistor for both tubes? > Fender cathode biased amps with both tube’s cathodes through one > resistor. The schematics I was looking at were for 6V6 amps though. > But the directions that Doug Roccaforte outlined involved running each > cathode through a separate 500ohm 5watt resistor, and I forget what > bypass caps. > Doug wasn’t talking about an UL Bassman amp though. I don’t know what > kind of difference that’ll make. > Pete > — > You call that limping? > I can limp circles around you! –Yumi > I’m running each cathode through a seperate resistor right now, with >no bypass caps. JK threw me for a small loop. > The amp is no longer UL. I modded it to triode a little while back, >but kept the diode bridge and huge 220mfd caps. Didn’t feel like looking >for a choke coil and tube rectifier.

I’d never looked into what it involved un-ULing one of those amps. You’ll have to check the bias on it at 900ohms resistors sometime, even if the procedure is a little bit pestier. I like the sound of my SF Bassman cathode biased, so I’ve been kicking around the idea of trying something similar on my PR, even though I couldn’t dig up anything about anyone having tried it. I think it’ll be easy if I give up the ability to use the tremolo, which I never use anyhow. But right now I’m sort of enjoying *not* dragging an amp across the house twice a day to work on it. Pete — You call that limping? I can limp circles around you! –Yumi

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>>>Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode >>>>>operation. >>>>>Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a >>>>>recommendation I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the >>>>>cathode ground and adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v >>>>>bypass cap. The hum balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors >>>>>are grounded. >>>>>With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of >>>>>standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. >>>>>Not good. >>>>>I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to >>>>>the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. >>>>>The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of >>>>>each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. >>>>>Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know >>>>>that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont >>>>>really know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm >>>>>recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow >>>>>the amps breaker. >>>>> west >>>>You’re supposed to run both cathodes through the resistor. >>>>jk >>>You mean just one resistor for both tubes? >>Fender cathode biased amps with both tube’s cathodes through one >>resistor. The schematics I was looking at were for 6V6 amps though. >>But the directions that Doug Roccaforte outlined involved running each >>cathode through a separate 500ohm 5watt resistor, and I forget what >>bypass caps. >>Doug wasn’t talking about an UL Bassman amp though. I don’t know what >>kind of difference that’ll make. >>Pete >>– >>You call that limping? >>I can limp circles around you! –Yumi > I’m running each cathode through a seperate resistor right now, with >no bypass caps. JK threw me for a small loop.

For the original given resistance value, both 6L6’s should run through the same cathode resistor. I’ll presume you guys are familiar with Ohm’s law and its application here but have just overlooked it. Running through separate unbypassed cathode resistors significantly increases the negative feedback and reduces the stage gain. The reported "increase in gain" is actually a decrease in gain and an increase in distortion for a given input signal level at a now reduced output power. Some of the increase in distortion level is due to a large amount of crossover (in-phase third harmonic) distortion. These changes may be desireable for a particular type of effect, but they will not enhance the overall versatility of the amplifier. The compression effect is due to the fact that as signal level goes up so does the DC bias voltage on the cathodes, effectively shutting the tubes down in proportion to signal level. Again, it’s an interesting effect, but not one you can shut off. Cathode bias is fine for small signal tubes, but is not that great for the longevity of power tubes and the things around them. These things I know from 30 years experience. But if you only believe http://www.people.cornell.edu/pages/mt24/Amp/mm/convert2cathode_bias…. jk

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>>>>Have a Bassman amp that I have converted from ultralinear to triode >>>>>>operation. >>>>>>Yesterday I decided to cathode bias the finals, using a >>>>>>recommendation I found in AGA’s archives, involving lifting the >>>>>>cathode ground and adding a 500 ohm 5 watt resister with a 25mf 100v >>>>>>bypass cap. The hum balance was disconnected and the 220kohm resistors >>>>>>are grounded. >>>>>>With the amp in standby, everything was ok. When I came out of >>>>>>standby, the 6l6’s plates started a slow but steadily increasing glow. >>>>>>Not good. >>>>>>I added another 400 ohms (900 ohms now), removed the bypass caps to >>>>>>the cathode ground, and fired it up with no noticable glow on the plates. >>>>>>The sound is VERY compressed, with extreme gain in the high input of >>>>>>each channel. The low inputs sound really, really bluesy ala ZZ Top. >>>>>>Question: is there an optimal cathode resistance that works? I know >>>>>>that the 900 ohms I have now is just a starting point, But I dont >>>>>>really know how close I am to the edge. I DO know that the 500 ohm >>>>>>recommendation I started off with was over the edge. Enough to blow >>>>>>the amps breaker. >>>>>> west >>>>>You’re supposed to run both cathodes through the resistor. >>>>>jk >>>>You mean just one resistor for both tubes? >>>Fender cathode biased amps with both tube’s cathodes through one >>>resistor. The schematics I was looking at were for 6V6 amps though. >>>But the directions that Doug Roccaforte outlined involved running each >>>cathode through a separate 500ohm 5watt resistor, and I forget what >>>bypass caps. >>>Doug wasn’t talking about an UL Bassman amp though. I don’t know what >>>kind of difference that’ll make. >>>Pete >>>– >>>You call that limping? >>>I can limp circles around you! –Yumi >> I’m running each cathode through a seperate resistor right now, with >>no bypass caps. JK threw me for a small loop. >For the original given resistance value, both 6L6’s should run through >the same cathode resistor. I’ll presume you guys are familiar with >Ohm’s law and its application here but have just overlooked it. Running >through separate unbypassed cathode resistors significantly increases >the negative feedback and reduces the stage gain. The reported >"increase in gain" is actually a decrease in gain and an increase in >distortion for a given input signal level at a now reduced output power. > Some of the increase in distortion level is due to a large amount of >crossover (in-phase third harmonic) distortion. These changes may be >desireable for a particular type of effect, but they will not enhance >the overall versatility of the amplifier. The compression effect is due >to the fact that as signal level goes up so does the DC bias voltage on >the cathodes, effectively shutting the tubes down in proportion to >signal level. Again, it’s an interesting effect, but not one you can >shut off. Cathode bias is fine for small signal tubes, but is not that >great for the longevity of power tubes and the things around them. >These things I know from 30 years experience. But if you only believe >http://www.people.cornell.edu/pages/mt24/Amp/mm/convert2cathode_bias…. >jk

Thanks Jim. Those are some things I’ll consider, but at least for now, my Bassman head is staying pretty much the way it is now because it’s working well for me. When I try to cathode bias the PR, I’m been expecting to do it a little bit more normal, with both tubes going through one resistor, and a bypass cap. I bookmarked and made a copy of that link you just gave. Pete — You call that limping? I can limp circles around you! –Yumi

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